Interesting analysis. I think I knew that having less cylinders would be an issue and still went for it
I have to pipe in. V8’s will be around for a long time yet and will have a place in future motor vehicles. That said I think the ls/lt/hemi approach to things will fade very quickly as smaller lighter turbo technology will have to be implemented by GM and Dodge to be competitive (look at ford, has been using DOHC v8’s for many years now and the coyote engine is just another step closer to a proper small displacement American made/style v8.
The issue is not fuel consumption of emissions, its the weight vs power produced compared to a v6turbo or 4turbo. Euro cars have been treading down the path of smaller and smaller v8’s for some time now and this is where the future of the v8 lies. Not in American/Australian muscle cars but high end European luxury cars.
The other side of the coin is diesel technology with Toyota leading the way here with the twin turbo Landcruiser but this will not last long as straight 6’s are simply much cheaper and easier.
Yup, non-truck V8 diesels are most definetely on the retreat. All three of the expensive germans used to have V8 diesels between the late 90s and late 2000s, only to abandon the concept again in favor of adding more turbos to their existing six-cylinder diesels. Toyota was late to the party in the first place, but is also beginning to phase out the 1VD on markets with tight emissions regs.
All hail our six cylinder diesel overlords.
With the half-exception of that turbo v12 tourer you submitted in CSR17, but I only say half because I know that engine was @phale’s handiwork (I guess that it almost won really supports your assertion). This said it can be quite difficult to suspend disbelief when one asks for a reasonably priced civilian sleeper car and gets a v12 hot hatch with 420bhp (see: Dragawn, CSR1). That retails for 30k.
Tycoon mode will hopefully sort much of this, though it’ll be a real challenge to get the balance right.
The funny thing is, since I won CSR12/hosted CSR13, I have submitted a V12 for every round except KLinardo’s muscle car round. And I would have absolutely submitted a V12 there if muscle cars didn’t have to have V8s. It’s definitely interesting to go from turbo V12s to a 40hp OHV I4, haha.
In real life though, I personally have no problem with the trend towards downsizing and turbos. In my mind, the only practical downside to fewer cylinders is less smoothness. That’s why I’m such a big fan of the inline six, because it can be powerful, smooth, and efficient. BMW’s latest offerings can squeeze well over 400hp from a 3.0L I6, which I think is plenty enough power for any reasonable needs. Call me a weird car guy, but I’ve never felt any sort of visceral attachment to big engines. I won’t deny that V8s and V12s sound beautiful, but I’d rather take the engine that is cheaper, lighter, and more efficient any day.
Well, as long as the engine is still “large enough” for the purposes. There’s clearly a state where given a certain technology volumetric efficiency is maximised, same with running a certain amount of boost. Less cylinders is also simpler and cheaper to engineer. Expressed in this manner this is why @koolkei’s unusually large displacement i4s seem so successful in the Automation verse. That said it’s difficult to appreciate what a smoothness of 50 for a 3L i4 is like compared to a smoothness of 70-80 for a V12.
The other note is that having an AR ratio of above 1 actually quite significantly delays boost in favour of top end power, and it’s difficult to actually imagine what it’s like to drive that on the street (well, not really, it means you put your foot down and nothing happens for several seconds while the compressor struggles to overcome the backpressure). I note that a lot of cars with turbos currently run very high AR ratios, including cars with lower outputs for street applications. This is no doubt partly the product of the system that’s well known to need an overhaul, but still something worth remembering.
Yeah while i am not a turbo person ( in the game world at least ). I have found that 1.0 ±.5 A/R with smaller size turbo’s in the 40-49mm range to be very good for economy but the engine still runs out of puff as soon as the engine starts pulling more air than the turbo’s can feed it (this is just my theory)
Exhibit A small turbo large A/R
Notice how at 4000RPM we have just about reached peak power with peak torque just dropping, the moment we do this the engine flat-lines and holds that max power while bleeding torque off rapidly but the turbo pressure has remained constant, but the fuel curve suddenly goes skywards (I think because the engine starts wanting more CFM than the turbo’s are capable of)
Just felt the need to share for some reason…still abit drunk from last night lol
well i didn’t realise the discussion has gone this far…
but out of all the buyer demographics, how many actually cares what kind of engine they have? and how many actually only care about the power and fuel consumption figures they make?
i’d say downsizing is a side effect of moving to making more ‘global cars’.
the car need the power for bigger roads in better off countries,
and the car needs to give the efficiency the second and third world nations demands
and small engines with turbos give the best of both… is it the best option? depend on where you look from.
but aside from prestige, what downside does it have?
rough running? we have enough technology to counter at least some of it to tolerable levels.
complex systems? remember, the actual number of people that actually wrench themselves is not that big in some places, and for some companies, they don’t ever consider much of this aspect anyway.
Here it really does depend on the buyer but… The new Ford Mustang Sold out 4000 cars in a few short months and most were v8’s even though the 2.3 ecoboost is the better option on fuel, handling and is still as fast most V8’s. But because it’s not a V8 the thinking generally is " well why would I buy a 4 cylinder Mustang when I can have a v8"
Same as the 2L ecoboost Falcon. It was brilliant, much better than the n/a 4.0 6. The same sort of acceleration with better highway acceleration BUT it was a 4 and Australians don’t want a 4 cylinder falcon.
yeah, i’m pretty sure that’s just the demographic of buyer, just like the reason why pushrods haven’t died even today
@Darkshine5 now that’s why the SLX sales were so slow and going to be axed soon , it may be economical but no one wants a full size SUV with V6 Hybrid
Introducing the facelifted QTL , The End- 1 Trims
Auxuras QTL SpectaL Sport Hybrid (SC-AWD)
Engine : JA Series , JA35Y5Z (289HP) with Electric Motor (66HP)
[quote]The QTL is a full-size crossover SUV manufactured by Auxuras the luxury division of Saminda , Saminda announced in a press release on November 11, 2014 , that the 2015 would mark the final year on the market for QTL as Auxuras will sharpens its focus on core products.
If you didn’t know what’s the reason behind it , the QTL suffered from low sales and it is one of the worst selling vehicle in the United States , after struggles for keeping the QTL , Saminda decided to axe the QTL for good.
In its final model year, the all-wheel-drive 2015 Auxuras QTL retains its 355-hp 3.5-liter V-6 with electric motor and seven speed dual clutch automatic.
##Sales figure 2015 : 741
Greensburg, Indiana, United States
QTL SpectaL Sport Hybrid (SC-AWD) : $79,995
#Saminda Boss talks about RWD and V8’s , might happen , might…
“Expect the best” sounds familiar right ? That’s the slogan for Saminda since it founded , remember when Kuro Saminda is alive , he only allow the best engines to be in production , if the engine is not up to standard , he will never allow it . That’s why Saminda is currently the biggest engine maker , but the largest engine maker doesn’t bulit a V8 engine?
Saminda Boss , Yuko Nagoya said in a interview that “Rear Wheel Drive is possible , i mean if there is a demand , why not? we are looking for a right direction that customers would like to see , Americans love V8’s of course , but we must also look into the market now , whether V8’s are still in demand , people sure want a V8 engines from us , but buying and want is a total different thing , i do love to see V8 happen here , but the world is looking more into efficency.”
Recently Saminda announced that V6 will cut lesser production after next year due to more focus on 4 cylinder turbo. Which means more V6’s vehicle will become 4 cylinder turbo.
I think Saminda is traditionally very conservative , i for one wouldn’t think that Saminda will ever bulit RWD and V8’s , it’s kind of a laughing stock when a big manufacturer like Saminda with 355hp as the most powerful engine.
Auxuras slogan would be “We don’t even know where the f**k we are going”
Finally, some optimism from the Japanese brand. Could this shift in philosophy improve the prestige and performance of certain cars enough to offset the extra purchase and running costs? On the other hand, swapping V6s with turbo straight fours will make the rest of the range sound much more generic.
Forget it bro , previously on one article , Saminda actually were developing a V8 engine . But for whatsoever reason they cancelled it , we have heard to many broken promises … beside that the article already said “might” which means impossible
i know cause i am keeping an eye on Saminda since day 1
Well, how about putting 2 v6s together? Using similar parts (internals, valves, bands, turbos…) will diminish the costs and engineering time (at this point, after many year, Samida can design SOHC inexpensively and with their eyes closed).
I’m pretty sure that V8 rumors and RWD are somewhat caused by CZ7 prototype
Just so you know, Pearlite made a 550hp V8 muscle car with 30mpg back in 2013
Back then my OHV 5.4 liter V8 made 34 MPG as well lol
Oh how builds change.