1970: Continous Evolving
The following is a transcript of one of Franco Lissa interviews
Entrevista a la Guillia
Radio Televisora Fruinia, 1971
G - Welcome, everyone, to our section of Entrevista a la Guillia. I’m Guillia Toreno, and tonight we have a very special guest. We are here with Franco Lissa, three-time Global Sportscar Champion, two-time winner of the 24 Hours of Narnilla, and currently head of the Kurosake Racing Division. Franco, it is a pleasure to have you with us.
F - Thank you, Guillia. It’s a pleasure to be here. I’ve been wanting to come on the show for quite some time. I’m a great admirer of the program.
G - That’s very kind of you. Well, let’s talk about the man behind all those achievements. Last year, you became the oldest driver to win the 24 Hours of Narnilla and the Global Sportscar Tournament, at fifty years old, with the help of the Dalluhan brand Kurosake. What does it feel like to hear all of that said out loud?
F - Honestly? It makes me feel a little older than I did this morning.
G - I’m sorry, Franco. We television presenters have a responsibility to remind people of their age.
F - Then you’re doing an excellent job.
G - But seriously, what do you think made that achievement possible?
F - Many years of work, really. And a lot of very good people around me. When I was racing as a privateer in the Mille Monti, Shinji Kurosake saw something in me, and we became very close. We started working together to develop the brand across Fruinia. He trusted my ideas, and I shared his vision. We both loved racing from a young age. We drove because we enjoyed it, and eventually Shinji developed this wonderful obsession with building his own cars. But you know, Guillia, there’s an important lesson in racing: you have to sell on Monday all the glory you earned on Sunday.
G - Very true. My husband certainly seems to believe that. He owns an Aqua, you know.
F - Does he?
G - Yes. We go to the beach every month, and he has never complained about the car. He actually bought it after seeing you, a Fruinian, win the GST in the Ju.
F - That’s very nice to hear.
G - The Ju must have been one of the great highlights of your career. What was it like to drive?
F - The Ju was an extremely innovative car for its time. It was Shinji’s vision of the perfect sports car, and I think the passion we put into it gave us the opportunity to win.
It was one of the most satisfying cars I’ve ever driven, but also one of the most frightening.
G - Frightening? You don’t sound like a man who frightens easily.
F - You learn not to show it (Laughts).
G - That’s a very diplomatic answer.
F - The truth is, the Ju was a challenging machine to master. You had to respect it. Once you understood what the car wanted from you, though, it could be magnificent.
G - You mentioned Shinji Kurosake. He shared that victory with you in Narnilla, but he had started his business in 1950, when he was still in his twenties. Looking back, your influence must have helped him establish Kurosake as a renowned name in Fruinia.
F - Shinji deserves most of the credit for that. The man has an extraordinary vision. I could give him what I knew from the track. There’s a difference between knowing how a car behaves on paper and actually sitting behind the wheel and finding out what it does at speed. Shinji has always asked me for advice on his race cars, particularly when he wanted to know how something would behave outside the drawing board.
G - And I imagine you were always happy to give him your opinion.
F - That’s part of why we worked well together. He understood the engineering side of the car, and I understood what the driver needed from it.
G - You and Shinji returned to the GST with the Ni-Ju, but I understand there was a deeper story behind that car than what we saw last season. Could you tell us about it?
F - Certainly. After the Ju Evoluzione program we developed for our privateers, Shinji came to me with one of the designs I’d sent him for the Evoluzione program. He handed it back to me and said, “Let’s make this. Let’s win the GST.”
G - Straight to the point.
F - That’s Shinji. I told him, “Shinji, if we’re going to win the GST, we’ll need more than one car. We can’t expect the same miracle we had with the Ju.” He then told me we were going to run two cars as a factory effort, while some privateers would have the opportunity to upgrade to the same specification. That’s very important in a tournament. You need to collect points wherever you can.
G - After seeing the Ni-Ju, I have to ask: was the finished car the same as your original design? And why was it called the Ni-Ju?
F - Not exactly. The GST has a three-litre displacement limit, so the engine I originally designed was different. Shinji decided to use the same basic platform we had developed for the Ju. The chassis and suspension followed what I’d designed, with help from several aeronautical engineers Shinji hired for the bodywork. The result was the Ni-Ju. As for the name, Shinji has a tradition of naming the first benchmark car of each decade after the number of decades Kurosake has existed since the 1950s. The Ichi was the first. The Ju marked ten years. And the Ni-Ju represented twenty years of the brand.
G - A car that carries the company’s history in its name.
F - Exactly. Shinji likes his cars to have a story.
G - I can see that. Now, using the previous generation engine must have helped you become familiar with the machine during preparation. Mechanically, how would you describe the Ni-Ju’s success?
F - Well, apart from the basic engine platform, almost everything was new. We bored the engine from 2.8 to 3 litres and heavily modified the supercharger. That gave us another hundred horsepower over the Ju. For the chassis and suspension, we concentrated on saving weight. We used fibreglass and retained the reliable double-wishbone arrangement. The cockpit was smaller, which wasn’t particularly luxurious.
G - I’m sure your drivers appreciated that.
F - They complained about it. The cockpit was tight, but we tried to make it as comfortable as possible within the limitations. Every bit of weight mattered. People might have expected another frightening machine like the Ju, but the Ni-Ju was actually much more pleasant to drive. The aerodynamics kept the car planted, and it was much better suited to endurance racing.
G - So despite being faster, it was actually easier to live with?
F - Much easier. And in endurance racing, that’s important. You don’t just need a fast car. You need one that the driver can trust for hours.
G - That sounds like something you learned the hard way.
F - Most useful lessons are learned that way.
G - The Ni-Ju was certainly an exceptional machine, but the car could not have done it alone. What can you tell us about the team behind it?
F - When Shinji told me he’d arranged the second car, I didn’t expect the journey I would have to make to meet half the team. After we finished the first Ni-Ju, Shinji asked me to ship the car and meet the team in Ellisbury! while they finished the second unit. We would develop the setups for both teams at the same time.
G - And you didn’t take a flight to Ellisbury, did you?
F - No. We couldn’t afford to fly the car.
G - Ah, the glamorous side of motorsport.
F - Exactly. I suggested taking shifts with our truck driver and delivering it ourselves. It took two days, but we made it to Ellisbury. That’s where I met the drivers of the number four car.
I saw a familiar face there. Shinji had called Rockford to drive the Ni-Ju. The last time I’d seen him, he’d been part of our Aqua effort in Gasmean Stock racing. That project didn’t succeed because our circumstances were difficult at the time, but Rockford had remained very loyal to the brand.It was genuinely wonderful to see him again.
G - And he wasn’t alone.
F - No. There were two other drivers, Flyn Fletcher and Kyle Reynold. Both were young talents from the Gasmean stock-car scene. Mike told me they were very accomplished there and wanted the chance to experience something faster and more refined. So we worked together. We prepared the cars, developed the setups, and made sure the drivers were ready for the tournament.
G - And what was happening with Shinji back at headquarters? What about the other team?
F - Kurosake is a corporation, and that sometimes means there are more people involved than the ones you see at the track. For the Ju, Shinji had to give a large part of the company to a board. At first they didn’t interfere much, as long as they received their payments. But when the Ni-Ju project was announced, they had already signed a Dalluhan driver, Ashkir Al-Malik. He’s part of the royal family and the Dalluhan elite, but he was also an excellent driver. He had won several Dalluhan Grand Tours in a modified Kurosake Ju, so he had plenty of experience. And having a Dalluhan driver winning in a Dalluhan car was important for Kurosake.
G - Shinji also looked abroad, didn’t he?
Franco: Yes. During one of his trips to enjoy motorsport, he saw a young driver named Hermann Estrom competing in Hetvesia. He said the young man reminded him of himself when he first started racing.
G - That must have been enough for Shinji.
F - Pretty much. He asked me to come back for one more season. I had already been telling him that I was getting old for this sort of thing.
G - At fifty?
F - At fifty.
G - That’s hardly ancient.
F - Tell that to my knees. But I agreed because those young drivers needed someone with experience in endurance racing. If I could help them avoid some of the mistakes I made when I was young, then another season was worth it.
G - And what a season it turned out to be. I understand the car had already raced in the previous year. How did you prepare for the 1970 tournament?
F - We entered the final two races of the 1969 season to give the car a proper test before the following year. The 1970 season used the same circuits as the previous calendar. Ten races across the world. We wanted two factory-backed cars at every race, but the distances made that extremely expensive. Because of the logistics, we could only run one factory effort at five of the events.
G - So, race by race, how did you approach the tournament?
F - The first race was the 24 Hours of Ellisbury at the Tri-Oval. We had practiced there when I first met the Gasmean team. I learned that you couldn’t simply run flat-out all the time. The circuit punished that. So I told the Gasmean team to take care of the car. We started around midfield, and as the race went on, other cars began having mechanical problems. Our old reliable inline-six had fewer moving parts, and that started to work in our favour. We were looking at a possible one-two finish. I took the night shift to help keep the car cool, but unfortunately the number four car pushed harder than it could manage and blew its supercharger.
G - And you?
F - Toward the end, I could feel our own supercharger beginning to lose pressure. I had to back off during the final stages. Our rivals managed to take the victory, but we brought the car home in second.
G - A good result, even if not the one you wanted. The next race was in Eastport am i right?
F - Yes. The Gasmean team was our only Kurosake entry for the 12 Hours of Eastport, so I stayed behind to support the drivers. They drove a very calm race. They didn’t push the car unnecessarily, and that made the difference.
The Ni-Ju secured its first victory.
G - The first Kurosake´s victory, and with that achievement the third race was the Durbridge 1000 kilometres.
F - Another race for the Gasmean team. Heavy rain and fog made it extremely difficult.
The Ni-Ju was competitive, but we couldn’t secure a podium. Still, we finished without an accident, which meant the car remained in good condition for the next race in Hetvesia.
G - Then the number three car finally had its turn at Villa Solario.
F - Yes. The Temple of Velocity. It was an incredibly fast circuit, and unfortunately the Ni-Ju didn’t have enough power to compete with some of the other cars. Our inline-six, even with the supercharger, made 350 horsepower. The Gasmean and Fruinian competitors were heavier but had more than fifty horsepower over us. When you’re spending so much of the lap in a straight line, there’s only so much you can do. We finished fourth.
G - Not every race can be a victory.
F - Exactly. Sometimes you take the points and go home.
G - The Mille Monti had been disbanded by then because of safety concerns. You then raced the Targa Raicanta, near your home county.
F - Yes. I had seen firsthand how dangerous the Mille Monti could become. The Targa Raicanta was the only time-trial event in the tournament, and I was given the opportunity to race in my home country for the last time. It had always been a smaller event compared with the Mille Monti. We simply went around Raicanta village and the surrounding roads along the Jamega River. But now it had become a major event, and our high horsepower cars were eligible. Even Shinji was hesitant about entering. He thought the risk was too high.
G - And you convinced him otherwise.
F - I told him that if we didn’t race, the DNF from the previous event would count against us. And I knew those roads. I knew every corner.
G - That sounds like a very Franco Lissa quest.
F - Perhaps.
G - Did it work?
F - Eventually. The winding roads actually helped us. We couldn’t reach the same speeds we could on a circuit, so the risk was somewhat reduced. Our supercharger was excellent in the mountains. The acceleration coming out of the corners was tremendous. It was one of the best drives of my career.
G - And also your last one in Fruinia…
F - Yes… After the race, I announced my retirement. I’d won, but I also realized that my body wasn’t going to tolerate those speeds forever.
G - That’s a difficult thing for a racing driver to admit.
F - It wasn’t easy. But racing has given me a wonderful life. I didn’t want to wait until the decision was made for me.
G - Then came the Ober-Unter 1000 kilometres.
F - We raced on village roads around Ober and Unter, and both cars were back together. Estrom was particularly enthusiastic that night.
G - Enthusiastic?
F - Very enthusiastic.
G - That’s a polite way of putting it.
F - He was young. We were all young once.
G - Were you quite like that?
F - I wasn’t much better. But Shinji was not as amused. Estrom nearly got himself removed from the team. The car took a few hits, but fortunately it kept going. Ashkir and I did our best, but the number four car was more consistent through the hilly valleys of Hetvesia and took another victory. We finished fourth after losing power…
G - …Then Silbertmatt.
F - One of the most demanding races in the world. Nearly twenty-five kilometres of twisting mountain roads, with a long straight at the end. The weather was difficult, particularly the rainstorm. There were several moments when the car nearly spun. But during the night, many drivers started going off the track. Rockford and I were driving during that shift. We weren’t trying to be heroes. We simply knew the circuit and understood the conditions. That experience gave us our first one-two victory.
G - Then, once again, Narnilla.
F - Kurosake had always had a reputation for winning there because of our reliability. With the Ni-Ju and its larger supercharger, however, we had to rely more on speed. Fortunately, being lighter than the competition helped us with tyre management and refuelling. Unfortunately, luck wasn’t on our side. After twenty hours, Ashkir was leading when he suffered a puncture and crashed outside the circuit.
G - After twenty hours…
F - Yes.
It’s a hard thing to watch after that much time. But the number four car kept going and secured the victory, giving Kurosake another win at Narnilla.
G - And then the Gasmean team was assigned to Wilburg.
F - I’d never raced there myself, but I knew the circuit had been changed. They had moved the urban race to a purpose-built track because the village course had become too dangerous. The team started strongly and managed the car very well. Unfortunately, after all the repairs and rebuilds, the engine block finally gave up.
G - The engine exploded?.
F - Yes. Quite decisively.
G - Was Reynold alright?
F - Thankfully, yes. That was the important thing. The number four car was beyond practical repair. Mike told us he’d rather keep it and rebuild it himself than transport it all around the world again.
G - And then there was only one race left.
F - The Dalluha Canyons, at the Adhrasi circuit. I remembered the area from the Grand Tour, but the tournament race was held on a permanent circuit. After several DNFs, we knew exactly what we needed to do. We had to win. Ashkir was on home soil and drove a fantastic race. Estrom also avoided several near-collisions early on, which helped us gain some positions. Then I took over for the final part of the race. At that point, I simply focused on bringing the car home.
G - And then the leader had a mechanical problem.
F - Yes. With about a hundred kilometres remaining, the leader suffered a mechanical failure. We took the lead. And that was my final victory.
G - What a way to get your last victory.
F - It was a good way to finish. Not just because we won the race. We had worked so hard on that car. Shinji, the drivers, the engineers, the mechanics, everyone. To finally see all that work come together was very satisfying.
G - Franco, that really was a remarkable season. I’m sorry to hear that you have retired from racing. We Fruinians have watched your career for many years, and it will certainly be strange not seeing you out there. But what comes next?
F - Life goes on, Guillia. I’m still head of the Kurosake Racing Division, and our new driver is doing very well in her shifts. Just as we did with the Ju, we’re planning to develop the Ni-Ju for customer racing in the years ahead. I’ve also been working with Shinji in Dalluha for some time. The Aqua is getting rather old now, and we’re hoping to begin the new decade with something exciting for everyone. It’s planned to come out next year.
G - Then I’ll certainly be watching to see what you and Shinji come up with. And Franco, thank you very much for joining us tonight. It has been a pleasure hearing these stories from the man who lived them.
F - Thank you, Guillia. I’ve enjoyed it very much.
G - That was Franco Lissa everybody. A retired champion, still putting his name in the motorsport scene.
F - I don’t think I’ll ever quite retire from that.
G - I am certain of that, Have a good night, Franco.
F - Good night, Guillia.
G - And to all our viewers, don’t forget: next week we have another special guest here on Entrevista a la Guillia. Stay tuned!
Dont forget to visit the video and photo Gallery at the start of the forum to have more content of Kurosake
Ni-Ju Video Resumee
Special Thanks
I also want to give a special thanks to the following creators for helping me expand this universe with their own vehicles and ideas. You are the real GOAT into making the brand feel like a part of a real world hehe
Morano 91 Turismo - @samasu
Flocon Elvia Fanucci 110 - @Fembrownie
Sigurdsson FT2000 Rally - @splendidsloth
