Yeah, those old 4A engines were pretty bullet proof.
MTBF will be changing to reliability in coming updates, but reliability is kinda a subjective term… In my mind I see reliability as the potential for longevity with an engine, and its internal parts, not things that are serviced or replaced like headgaskets… So I don’t think the Iron block/aluminium head should really have any reliability malus, instead it should have small increase to service costs to offset the possible increased replacement of headgasket. It shouldn’t be too much though, I doubt many cars get more than one headgasket replaced in their lifetime, and some never need it…
There are some engines that can be quite reliable, but need more regular service. Turbo cars like my Saab 9-3 are a good example of this… They can do upwards of 400,000km which is pretty impressive for a small turbo engine, and with proper maintenance and regular oil changes the Turbo charger should last the life of the engine as well… However, if you don’t change your oil enough it will break down from all the heat and you’ll start to wear things… People who neglect oil changes on these cars end up replacing turbos, timing chains(which are supposed to last the life of the engine) and getting bad sludge buildup that eventually leads to engine failure…
I would think to get a good reliability rating in the game with multi material engines would be to really increase quality on the heads (for any era). To face the obvious it has taken many many decades of R&D to get aluminum to work to any standard to the stress of a motor. Aluminum is very unforgiving with stress, and doesn’t hold up nearly as well as iron. The fact that aluminum expands and contracts at a different rate can be overcome, but it would require more time spend on R&D compared to iron block/heads or aluminum block/heads. Also aluminum wasn’t a good head or block material until the 70s. Some older folks can tell you about the first all aluminum mass produced and successful V6 (The GM Fireball 215). Buick, Oldsmobile, and Pontiac started the design of the all aluminum engine starting in 1951 and started putting them in the 1961 model year. The glycol alcohol (antifreeze) corroded the cooling galleys on the all aluminum block and heads (some were iron, some aluminum). They also had problems with warped heads with higher compression on them. They got a bad rap for blowing head gaskets and over heating often. Rover then bought the tooling, and design of the 215 and I think Rover tried several variants of aluminum and iron block/heads. They were still building the 215 up until not to long ago. Goes to show the idea of aluminum as a tempting material for engine design is worth all the trouble! Proving to make a reliable multi material engine (in general) requires more attention to design.
You make some good points… I didn’t consider the really early aluminium engines when I wrote my post, but it seems to me that by the 70’s the issues with iron block/ aluminium head were mostly dealt with… Maybe the games tech system that we have yet to see is the solution to this. So if you develop the aluminium technology enough it becomes a non issue…
The thing that does bother me though with the current system is that there is never any reason to mix materials unless you are trying to recreate a historical design, or are trying to make a bad engine on purpose… Why choose aluminium head on an iron block when you can go all aluminium and have none of the reliability issues?.. It doesn’t make for good gameplay.
90 and beyond you can go iron head aluminum block with a few tech points to the head and get better power, less emissions, and only a small hit to mtbf.
By the 2010s, the MTBF hit is very small, and could be considered insignificant. On a semi-related note, cast iron blocks will give you a few extra horsepower.
By the 2010s, the MTBF hit is very small, and could be considered insignificant. On a semi-related note, cast iron blocks will give you a few extra horsepower.[/quote]
Of the two I’ve found using iron heads brings more power at a lower cost to quality slider where as aluminum block cuts emissions by about as much as heads. Of course I tend to use pushrod heads so I’m not sure if there’s more of a effect with ohc.
By the 2010s, the MTBF hit is very small, and could be considered insignificant. On a semi-related note, cast iron blocks will give you a few extra horsepower.[/quote]
I concur. The required quality slider for reliable multi material block/heads should decrease with each decade. By 2020 no extra quality is needed for reliable designs. Realistically the aluminum head should be offered in 1950. Every major US manufacturer was designing and testing aluminum heads and aftermarket companies were selling performance aluminum heads at that time (although suffering with reliability). Aluminum blocks should be offered to be used starting in 1950 as well but would require alot of tech points and quality to make it hold up to any decent power output.
Aside from the buick 215 though I have trouble thinking of many factory production engines that really made use of aluminum blocks or heads before the 70’s. They may have experimented with it but few really used it.
[quote=“JayZee88”]
Realistically the aluminum head should be offered in 1950. Every major US manufacturer was designing and testing aluminum heads and aftermarket companies were selling performance aluminum heads at that time (although suffering with reliability). Aluminum blocks should be offered to be used starting in 1950 as well but would require alot of tech points and quality to make it hold up to any decent power output.[/quote]
Remember, self-driving cars are being tested and developed in the present, but if that was to be available in the game, I would not say that it is a mass-market option. Remember, the options are unlocked as they become available to the masses.
In the 40s and 50s there were aluminum heads for Ford flatheads (aftermarket), Chrysler and GM also made special low production sets in the 50s and 60s, Jaguar XK6 came from the factory with aluminum heads. I am unsure about blocks, but aluminum in motors has been around as long as the motor. Althought not in mass production until after WWII. I found out that the reason why Buick used so much aluminum on their V8s in the 50s for thermostat housings, water pumps, etc was to see how aluminum holds up to corrosion in a motor. That is where they got the information on how to design the 215! For a long while I pondered why all the 50s Buicks I see under the hood have more aluminum then 10 of any other car of the era combined! Talk about a road test!
You’ve kinda proved the point though, with the exception of Jaguar, who were crazy, lucky, and brilliant back in the 40’s and 50’s, 60’s. And buick who spent more than a decade doing material research in their engine The only other cases were low volume builds, it was not widely available until the 70’s. But I suppose if you made a brilliant car right off the bat and got a lot of money in game you could solely invest your R&D department to that goal and have it by the late 50’s.
Your right I did lol. I think a big reason for that is the school of thought at the time was, if you wanted to shed weight make smaller, thinner cars (1961 LeSabre, 1962 Chevy Corvair compared to their full sized brother models). Shedding 20 lbs on heads at greater manufacturing cost didn’t make sense when all you had to do was make a lighter car. The late 50s and early 60s is when ‘compact’ cars started becoming popular, but today those compacts would be considered mid sized lol.
FIAT used aluminium heads on the engine 100 series, from 1955 to the 2000’s. The original engine was developed for the FIAT 600 as longitudinal RWD (Fiat 600 and 850) and extensevly used also on transverse FWD. (see Fiat Panda, Fiat 127, Autobianchi A112 and A112 Abarth)
That is cool! I didn’t think FIAT would have used aluminum for a head material that early considering they were still rebuilding from the war. I am surprised Porsche didn’t get into the aluminum head craze in the 50s!
James Dean had a 550 Spyder, but I never knew just how ingenious those motors were! Apparently the 550 had alot more aluminum in the motor then just the head. Holly molly Porsche! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Porsche_550
I’ve read a very intresting book written by the old chief engineer of FIAT Dante Giacosa (also the “father” of the fiat 500). He was talking about the war era and how FIAT were developing a full small aluminium engine to build via “shell” casting (easier and cheaper compared to others same era system - don’t know if it is the right term in english too) to start to build after the end of the war.
I don’t remember how it ends, if the projects were lost or became obsolete before the end of the war. I’m very curious about this project and unfortunatley it’s very difficult to find info about it.
FIAT was a great company in the past.
Wasn’t the VW Beetle engine from the beginning; Aluminium heads, Cast iron cylinders and Magnesium block?
Or was it the later ones (after the war) that had Alu heads?
