Fast for four (Part 2.2.3: Car reviews group 3)

[Knugcab]

Monaco, 1980

Meet Olivier Rossi. He’s… Well, the term “yuppie” really has not originated yet. But let’s just say that he is still young, carefree and is climbing the social ladder at a brisk pace. And he wasn’t really living in a cardboard box before that either. (Honestly speaking, I was more interested in the challenge subject than writing a backstory this time, so I will keep it short but good enough to give enough of a clue what to make.)

He is currently driving a 1975 Mercedes-Benz 280CE. That’s of course still a nice car, but starting to show some age, and now he wants to climb a notch on the ladder when it’s coming to performance and status. What he is looking for is a fast and prestigeous GT vehicle, with room for four if that should be needed, that still isn’t such a fragile and impractical mess that it needs to be garage kept instead of driven like an ordinary car (and very much of the time, harder than that).

PRIORITIES

STYLING - A car like this should not look like grandma’s beige runabout, I guess we can all agree. Also, realistic styling for the era and type of car. If it looks like it is straight out of the 90s, is just a silly meme build or more of a concept car than a production one, for example, it will not stand much of a chance here.

PRESTIGE - I guess I don’t have to explain why this status matters either. You can build a car that is all good on paper, but if it doesn’t have that little extra to impress, it’s hard for it to stand a chance.

PERFORMANCE - More or less what cars like this are all about. But just a “brr green number good green number go up” approach is not what I am looking for. To start with, I put a hard limit here on something that’s not even able to reach 200 km/h or accelerate to 100 in 8.5 seconds, since then faster family cars of the era will start to leave you behind. Yes, 201 km/h and 8.4 seconds is still not a good time to aim for, it just means that you will pass the instabin check.

On the other hand, if I remember right, the fastest 4 seater of the era was the Aston Martin V8 Vantage, that could accelerate from 0 to 100 in 5.2 seconds and reach a top speed of 270 km/h. Yes, Automation tend to make cars faster than they would be IRL so I give some margins there in judging, but aiming MUCH higher than that isn’t a shortcut to winning, he’s not looking for a hypercar, and I would also like to see some realism.

Also, cornering Gs, brake distances and driveability/sportiness fade will be counted into this stat, since driveability/sportiness stat numbers won’t give the whole truth here IMO.

SPORTINESS - Yes, this is not a challenge for the most extreme of the corner carvers, but he’s still not looking for a fast boat that is unwilling to turn.

COMFORT - We’re talking cars a bit more plush than outright sports cars now, doesn’t matter how fast you cover a distance if that’s still done in a torture chamber.

DRIVEABILITY - It is the early 80s. Driving a car like this will be more challenging than driving a little hatchback, but it is still worth keeping in mind.

SAFETY - Driving over 200 with something that will kill you in a fender bender is a bit scary, isn’t it?

RELIABILITY - A fragile hypercar that you will hardly dare to drive isn’t the brief of this challenge.

FUEL ECONOMY - Fast cars still gulped fuel back then, but with the energy crisises of the 70s in mind, the happy days where you didn’t have to care at all was now over. Also, not having to stop for fuel all the time when using the resources of the car would be nice, wouldn’t it?

SERVICE COSTS - It’s going to cost to service a car like this. Just keep an eye on them so they won’t reach silly heights.

PURCHASE PRICE - There is a budget and in this segment it’s not necessarily bad to use up all of it. With that said, if two cars are identical otherwise, why go for the more costly one?

INTERIOR STYLING - Interiors will not be required. Though, with almost three weeks until deadline, I don’t think I am a jerk for encouraging them, especially not in a segment where they tend to be rather nice looking. So, I did the compromise I have done a couple of times before. It is a low priority, but a nicely made interior CAN give you a slight edge over the competition. An interior that looks like a terrible mess won’t give you any disadvantage compared to doing none at all. But out of all priorities, this is one of the lowest…

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RULES

• Any model or family year. Trim and variant year 1980.
• Maximum total costs for techpool (the number to the right) when adding car and engine techpool is $33M. No negative techpool.
• No outright limits for the quality sliders, but try not to minmax them.
• The price of the car should not exceed $33 000 AMU.
• No V16 engines (I don’t have the DLC)
• Super leaded fuel (AFAIK there were no lead bans in Europe yet by then, and high octane fuels weren’t available without lead).
• The engine should be able to pass WES4 in the engine emissions tab.
• No race parts.
• At least one muffler.
• No semi slicks
• Minimum tyre profile: 50. Maximum rim size: 16". That’s still quite extreme for the era but gives some leeway. Staggered tyres allowed.
• No positive downforce (should still give a negative number in the performance tab).
• 4 seaters only (the back seat can be +2).
• 2 or 3 door bodies only. Remember what segment we’re in, building something looking like a Volvo 242 or VW Golf isn’t the smartest thing to do. No convertibles.
• Legacy bodies are allowed, but used at your own risk, if it imports messed up it is an instabin.

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Submissions opening: Sunday the 9th of June, 8 PM CEST.
Submissions closing: Friday the 28th of June, 8 PM CEST.
Naming convention: Engine family/variant: FFF - your user name / name of the engine. Car model/trim: FFF - your user name / name of the car.

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inspirations

(Yes, it could be kind of wild west in the segment, with everything from 4 to 12 cylinders, everything from wedges to classic looking sports cars to more “boxy” traditional coupés, injection or carbs, turbo or N/A, so I expect to see some variety here too, go for which approach you like here)

[moroza]

As prestige for the era goes, a well-handling sedan like a BMW E23 or Benz W126 gave up nothing to their 2/3-door competitors. And being able to carry (and impress) passengers certainly helps somone trying to schmooze in Monaco.

It’d be nice to see interiors cared about.

[Knugcab]

1. I am not objecting against that, because you’re absolutely right (not to mention the W116 6.9 that I think was still produced for 1980…droooooool!) , in this case it is more a matter of me wanting this exact subject for the challenge (and the short backstory written up as sort of an excuse afterwards), hence sedans not being cared for this time.

2. Personally, I am all for making interiors and I think they are a part as interesting as the exterior in this game. Especially in a segment like this where they could be really nice at the time compared to the breadboxes “regular people” were driving around in. It’s just that it seems like people are losing interest in challenges as soon as “interior” is mentioned, if you don’t require one but will factor it in you will still get some salt about being unfair, with that said I am all for including them but I don’t want it to put people off the challenge, so…I would gladly hear other people’s opinions there.

[Hshan]

IMO the main thing against interiors is the additional time they need. I have little skill in making them, as I’ve made just a few, but with enough time, I’ll usually want to include one in my car - even if it’s just a basic outline with no details, looking ok only from the outside. That’s why I’m all for encouraging interiors, but slightly against requiring them.

BTW, I really like the theme and even have an idea already of what I’d like to build for this - if it doesn’t end up too over the top…

[lotto77]

This entirely, I’m no stranger to making interiors (and have even had people say mine are nice for some reason I don’t get it), but the fact of the matter is that they’re a decent bit extra of rather fiddly work that’s not 100% essential to the looks of a car or the car itself in auto, which is understandably offputting to some.

That being said if someone makes a 2010’s challenge with required interiors I will cry, my skills run out in the 00’s…

[xsneakyxsimx]

V16, yay or nay?

[abg7]

This challenge would make for a great QFC, but with the actual QFC45 still in progress, making a new standalone thread just for this early '80s grand tourer competition makes perfect sense.

[Knugcab]

Oh, I sometimes forget that the V16 DLC exists since I don’t have it. The answer is “nay”.

[mart1n2005]

@Knugcab

• 2 or 3 door bodies only. Remember what segment we’re in, building something looking like a Volvo 242 or VW Golf isn’t the smartest thing to do.

How about this handsome beast

[Knugcab]

Well, to me (and also according to Volvo themselves), it feels like if the 262C was more influenced by the American “Personal luxury coupés” of the era, it is also rather obvious that it is based on an existing sedan if you ask me, and it would not look all that sleek if you put it next to the inspirations. I won’t instabin anyone based on design alone as long as the other rules regarding the body is followed, but on the other hand I would probably not put something in the style of a 262C all that high when it comes to the styling score (it is of course always hard to tell until you see the actual car). I suppose you’re mostly talking about styling now, since other things like performance would put the Volvo out of the competition anyway.

[mart1n2005]

So sedan based coupes are definitely out? Would a shooting brake based on a 3 door wagon type of body be ok though?

Also for a one off challenge like this with no expectations of carrying on with another round I can’t see the harm in at least expecting an attempt at an interior, the 70’s and 80’s are well catered for with ready made fixtures as it is anyway.

[fabiremi999]

• Are we allowed to enter with multiple cars or is only one entry allowed?

• Are the market stats important? Or even a certain stat required?

• Are any Car & Engine Suggestions allowed (The Blue, Yellow or Red flashing notifications)

• Is it even possible to pass WES4 with Leaded Fuel? AFAIK you can’t even use catalytic converters when using leaded fuel. EDIT: Nevermind, I just realized it is

[Hshan]

@fabiremi999

Are any Car & Engine Suggestions allowed (The Blue, Yellow or Red flashing notifications)

Oh! I think I’ve made a car without any… at least once? Well I can’t speak for Knugcab, but usually no red ones is ok, and deciding if the rest matter is up to you. I guess it won’t be different this time.
(BTW, I think most of my cars have some yellow warnings, even those scoring high in challenges)

[donutsnail]

@mart1n2005

So sedan based coupes are definitely out?

I suspect with the BMW 6 series in the inspirations there is some wiggle room there, but I take it there’s a high risk of seeming too pedestrian if you take that route. I may anyways since I have something that fits the bill though.

[Knugcab]

@mart1n2005

So sedan based coupes are definitely out? Would a shooting brake based on a 3 door wagon type of body be ok though?

Also for a one off challenge like this with no expectations of carrying on with another round I can’t see the harm in at least expecting an attempt at an interior, the 70’s and 80’s are well catered for with ready made fixtures as it is anyway.

I still would not say that “sedan based coupés” are “definitely out”, there are coupés with sedan equivalents that could absolutely work here even if they have shapes at the outer ends of the scope, though I can’t think about some good 1980 examples even if they may exist. I mean, even something shaped like the Volvo 780 could have worked if the challenge was held a bunch of years later (styling wise there is). In the exact case of the 262 though, it is IMO too obvious that it is just a coupé roof slapped on top of a 200 series Volvo, and without sporty ambitions, so well, that exact car would maybe not have scored very well styling wise. But if you get results that looks as sleek as you would expect a car in this class to be, I won’t care if there is a sedan equivalent to the body you’re using, or even if Automation classes the car as a sedan.

Shooting brakes…absolutely, as long as they give off an air of a shooting brake and not just a regular 2 door station wagon I am not objecting against them. I can’t think of too many IRL examples in production in 1980, but I think the Lotus Elite was still in production, for example, so something like that, sure.

@fabiremi999

• Are we allowed to enter with multiple cars or is only one entry allowed?
• Are the market stats important? Or even a certain stat required?
• Are any Car & Engine Suggestions allowed (The Blue, Yellow or Red flashing notifications)
• Is it even possible to pass WES4 with Leaded Fuel? AFAIK you can’t even use catalytic converters when using leaded fuel. EDIT: Nevermind, I just realized it is

1. One entry.
2. No.
3. Especially when making a sports car like this, you will most often have to do compromises that results in blue or yellow warnings, I (generally) won’t care about them at all. If you have a red warning, it means that something is really bad though. You should really fix that because if you have one your car will probably have flaws that means that it would not score good at all.
4. My test mule did without too much tweaking, so yes.

@donutsnail

I suspect with the BMW 6 series in the inspirations there is some wiggle room there, but I take it there’s a high risk of seeming too pedestrian if you take that route. I may anyways since I have something that fits the bill though.

That was kind of my idea yes. The 6 series is somewhat in the outside scope and could maybe be seen as the soft border that you will start taking greater risks after passing. As I said, don’t sweat an instabin for styling unless it is really, really wrong or bad, it is somehow fun that there is a rather great diversity between cars that could fit the brief. I guess it is like usual in challenges, you’re taking greater risks when you’re straying too far away from what is expected, and only you can decide if it is worth it or not. I really can’t say if a car would score high or low on design without seeing it, and if I told you something then there would not be much of a challenge left, so I guess this is about as clear as I can get.

[xsneakyxsimx]

EUDM or USDM license plates?

Edit: Literally missed the bolded title of “Monaco, 1980” right at the tippy top

[abg7]

I’m expecting the EU-sized (unscaled) plates, given that our client is based in Monaco.

[Knugcab]

I won’t care too much about that. From what I know (correct me if I am wrong) there are no Monaco plates in the game. I am by no means an expert, but when looking them up, they seem to be rather small and would fit an US plate recess. On the other hand the cars themselves are more likely to be EUDM in this case, so it somehow feels more natural with EUDM plates too. But plates won’t be reason enough for a bin as long as they are there and not resized…

[Happyhungryhippo]

che bella maccina!

The Cavaliere Nobile Zenturio. The elaborate choice.

A GT that fits in our time. It does have tax advantages with a displacement of just 2000ccm, still delivers 282 horsepower at surprisingly low consumption. Latest safety features and an interior that will leave no wish unfulfilled with mind-blowing technology and finest materials. A handling like you can expect from an exclusive Italian machine. Not to forget it seats the rear passengers comfortable and spacious.

Cavaliere Nobile. Cuore e mente.

[Knugcab]

I did a compromise on interiors. They won’t be needed, they will be judged. A good looking interior will not give a huge advantage, but still an advantage. A bad looking interior will not give a disadvantage over not doing one at all. So, if you really don’t want to make one, you can join anyway and still stand a chance. If you want to make one, it will not be work that’s just wasted. I think that with almost three weeks to go, this is a viable solution.