The story of Velkarja: Part 1 - the Karvelian empire has fallen (Rules delib!)

[Knugcab]

PROLOGUE

The year is 1946. After being under the reign of the Karvel dynasty for almost 300 years, the Karvelian empire has fallen, after a civil war and a successful revolution due to the faltering health of the former emperor, Michail the third. Now, the Karvelian empire is split into six countries. In the north, Nordhavn and Eirvik. In the south, Druzhinia and Karslavia. In the east, Kaivala. And in the west, Velkarja, the country we are going to play in.

All in all we won’t get the easiest start. Private motoring was banned in the Karvelian empire, a ban that will now be lifted, so sure there is a need for personal transportation. But the infrastructure at land is under all criticism. The rail only goes between the major towns, the roads barely exists and are mostly populated with carts that are pulled by horses, donkeys and oxen, spare for the occasional pre-war ARVA doing some taxi or police duty. And the people in general are poor. So surely there is a need for cheap cars, but it is questionable if you can sell that many cars to people living in log cabins in Kainmark that does hardly even have electricity yet. Of course, there is a portion of the filthy rich, and they are hungry for status symbols and not sheds on wheels - but how many can you sell? The middle class barely exists yet - but maybe you want to be the one that is there for them when they start to emerge. Of course, commercial vehicles will be needed for rebuilding the country - but then we are still talking niched vehicles. Which approach you want to take is all up to you…

Velkarja is at the moment being ran by a temporary government, that promises democratic elections “at some point in the future”. Some people believe in that more than others, so to speak. It is hard to tell right now what this mess of a country even will turn out like. But maybe it can only get better from this point…

STOP YOUR BLABBERING, WHAT IS THIS CRAP???

OK, yes, I am pulling off a legacy challenge, well aware that they might not have the best track record. But since I have had a good history (spare for once) of actually finishing my challenges, since I have been here for quite a long time by now, since I at least get the impression that I am a trusted member, I at least hope that you will rather say “oh, that sounds fun” than “oh no, not another one”. And I will post up more info in the upcoming days, but until then feel free to ask questions here since that will only make it easier for me to sum up the info.

Also, feel free to join the discord server for this (yes, I think this link is working but in case it is not, please tell me, and yes, I know that it is on the old 24h server so I might rename it to something better in the future) for further discussion.

Join the Knugcab's automation challenges Discord Server!

[Knugcab]

Q&A AND GENERAL CHALLENGE INFO

HOW DOES THIS WORK?

This challenge is what usually is called a “legacy challenge”. We start off in a country in 1946. You will register a company (I will put up the registration form later on), the game will go on for multiple rounds. You will keep playing as this same company for the multiple rounds to come, sending in new cars for each round. When the round is over, I will review the cars and tell how they succeeded on the market. The society will evolve, so will their taste in cars too, probably. Your mission is to stay relevant during the years.

DO I HAVE TO START IN 1946 AND PLAY ALL THE ROUNDS?

No. If you want to join later in the game, it will be all cool. If you want to stop after some rounds, it is all cool too. Or if you just want to send in for some of the rounds. As long as you have registered (info TBA) it is all fine how much or how little you want to play.

CAN I PLAY WITH DIFFERENT BRANDS FROM THE SAME COMPANY, LIKE FOR EXAMPLE FORD/LINCOLN/MERCURY IRL?

Yes, I will allow up to three brands from every company.

CAN I SEND IN MULTIPLE CARS?

I will allow up to three cars per round. They can be different variations of the same car, different cars sharing the platform or cars that doesn’t even have to do with each other. It is all up to you.

CAN I SEND IN OTHER VEHICLES THAN CARS AND LIGHT DUTY TRUCKS?

Generally, no. But there is a twist. I am kind of borrowing this idea from ALC I guess. If you have sent in one or more cars for a round, I will allow a “bonus entry”. I know we have people skilled in making other stuff than cars for Automation. So if you want to do a motorcycle, city bus or even something not even car related, like a toaster or something, you will get your chance, and I will give it a short review, and maybe it might even have a chance to make a cultural impact. Notice that this will only stay if people can use it in a sane way. If I get too many entries that makes no sense, like videogame consoles in the 40s or totally nonsense stuff that can’t even be reviewed, I will stop including this part. But my thoughts were that it could be fun to try.

WHAT DECIDES WHO WILL WIN OR LOSE?

Nobody will win or lose. Different segments will have different market shares anyway, you can’t put a hypercar against a kei truck and say which one that is better or worse, and not even all cars are intended to be top sellers. But there is a twist. I will include a thing I will call brand perception. Let’s say that you have for multiple rounds made cars more reliable than average. Then people will see your brand as “reliable” which might even help if you have built up a strong perception for that. It might even save you if you come with a model that suddenly has below average reliability - but keep in mind that such a thing will hurt your perception and save you just once.

Also, if you make many cars that seems to be the best ones in their segments, your brand might get a more positive perception overall, if you make many cars that seems to be the worst ones in their segments, you might get a more negative perception overall. If you break rules, it is not sure it will send you to the bins - but you might get a negative perception for that (think about the dieselgate scandal as an example). I will be transparent with the brand perception so you can see what you have a chance to try to fix and not.

HOW WILL TECHPOOL WORK?
I will start off with a low techpool, to represent that this is a poor country where any fanciness in the cars will cost an arm and a leg. Then, how society evolves will affect the techpool given for next round. Strong economy and development will give more extra TP, shit economy and no development will maybe give no extra TP at all. The only thing - you have to keep the same techpool for all three cars, and you can’t lower any techpool from last round. For example, if you have 2 techpool on chassis in round 1, you can’t put it any lower than 2 in round 2. I will come back in detail with how to solve this.

HOW WILL THE SEGMENTS BE DECIDED?
It all depends on the types of cars being sent in for each round. I will try to keep all segments at a reasonable size, split them up if they become too big, put them together if they shrink too small, to make the competition fair. For example, I get only one luxury MPV - it won’t deserve a category on its own but will be bunched together with the most suitable segment - maybe only “MPVs”. If I get 20 MPVs where 10 are luxury ones and 10 bread and butter ones, I will split that segment.

HOW WILL ADVERTISING WORK?
As in other challenges. Put up an ad in the thread for your car(s). But keep in mind, a really clever ad might improve your brand perception. One that backfires might damage it. If that sounds too complicated just make a regular ad, it’s really not what will make or break your car.

HOW FAR WILL IT BE BETWEEN ROUNDS?
RNG between 5 and 10 years.

WHAT DECIDES HOW SOCIETY WILL EVOLVE?
RNGs paired with my own imagination, and everything that has happened before since nothing that happens just comes out of nowhere. Also, one of the thoughts behind having the Discord is to kind of crowd source the world building. Keep in mind that even the cars you make might affect it. If you send in affordable cars that can reach 300 km/h with barely any brakes for the bad roads in the first round, you can count on people being good at killing themselves which will lead to actions from the government.

SPEAKING OF THAT, HOW ABOUT LOBBYING?
I might use a somewhat simpler system there than in previous legacy challenges, if anything, not 100% sure yet. It might also depend on how the government evolves. You will probably get less possibilities if the government turn out more totalitarian, maybe more possibilities if it turns out more libertarian. I don’t want to go deep into IRL politics discussions so let’s just leave it there. Lobbying is still an open question anyway, but there will be none for round 1 anyway.

[Knugcab]

INFORMATION ABOUT VELKARJA

(1946 and might be updated for later rounds)

Flag (1946)

Map (1946)

REGIONS:
Svelmark - A region with some mountains along the border to Nordhavn, some farmlands close to the river that is the border to the region of Ránmark, some seaports at the coast but mostly boreal forest. City of administration: Granhavn.

Ránmark - Not all that different from Svelmark, but better farmlands, less seaports. City of administration: Karvholm.

Kainmark - A region with mostly boreal forest, also has the largest amounts of lakes in the country. Timber rafting down to the sawmills in the area around Björkås is still large enough to be worth mentioning in 1946. Home to the largest miniority of the country, the Viranians, living in the inner parts of Kainmark, in 1946 still in their traditional ways in log cabins, from hunting, fishing the lakes, small household farming and often naturally skilled in forestry and woodworking. Next after Karsfjell seen as the least developed region by 1946. City of administration: Björkås

Skärvala - The economically most developed region by 1946, with a large amount of seaports it is an important region for trade and for tying together the otherwise very poor infrastructure. The only area that is becoming somewhat urbanized by 1946. City of administration: Svalholm

Karsfjell - A mountain region, poor and underdeveloped by 1946. There are rumours that there might be minerals to find there, but as we speak in 1946, nobody knows yet… Home to the second largest miniority by 1946, the mountain Karsans, a partly nomadic, reindeer herding people, holding on even more to their old ways than the Viranians. City of administration: Karghella.

DEMOGRAPHICS
Population in 1946 around 9 millions. A rather large portion being children and young adults, rather few over 60. Nativity high, but childrens health generally not the best at least in the most poor regions. Most people are poor or very poor. The middle class is small and unstable. Of course the upper class and the extremely wealthy are few - but compared to the small middle class the ratio is very unbalanced to their favour. Most people are living of small scale farming, fishing and forestry work. Some small industries have emerged in mainly the Skärvala region.

CLIMATE AND WEATHER
I have gotten the question, and I am thinking of this and being somewhere rather far north, but the ocean contains warm jet streams, and the bay in the middle of the country will probably affect things a lot. Without being a weather expert, I would guess that the winters would be rather mild temperature wise but more extreme when it comes to snow. The springs short, but dramatic with all the melting of snow and ice that could cause problems. The summers chilly, short but bright, and the autumns long and very damp and foggy. Probably a more harsh climate in Karsfjell and to some extent Kainmark.

INFRASTRUCTURE
At land, very poor. Works reasonably well at sea. Electricity and telephone still a luxury for a lot of the population. The roads are mostly built for horse drawn carriages and its likes, and needs rebuilding. Private motoring was banned in the Karvelian empire and the 1946 lift of the ban will probably have some consequences on its own. Rail only goes between major cities. Right hand traffic.

RELATIONS TO THE NEIGHBOURS
As we speak in 1946, the empire has being split up with a solution that most people are happy with, and after the civil war, nobody wants war anymore. So, the relation is neutral-good in general with the neighbouring countries. nobody says that it constantly will stay that way though.

POLITICS
The country is in 1946 ran by a “temporary” government that has the main focus on building up the country to more modern standards. There is talk about democratic elections being held “at some time in the future”. Nobody knows when yet. Or if it ever will happen.

(If you’re missing something this far I will be happy to fill in, I did what I could think about this far)

[Knugcab]

PART 1 - RULES

General rules for entries and submissions

• The car has to be created in sandbox in the current stable release (Al-Rilma)
• Submissions via DMs on the forums to me, only. All further communication via DM during this challenge should be held inside the same “conversation”.
• All cars for one round should be sent inside the same message. No resubmissions.
• If you haven’t registered via the form, do it before sending in entries. Only cars from brands registered in the form are allowed, except for the bonus submission.
• Max 3 entries + 1 bonus entry. Bonus entries only allowed if you have sent in at least one car for the round.

Car rules

• Model, trim, family and variant year should be set to 1946. In the future, older model and family years will be allowed, but since you can’t go lower than 1946…

• Fuel availability - Low quality unleaded is available to everyone, although rationed. You can get leaded regular if you have…the right contacts. If you can’t afford a stupidly expensive car you probably does not have those contacts, so I don’t recommend it for anything that isn’t a very high end car since that will only lead to people filling them up with low quality fuel, getting engine damage. Also, the high price means that I will count on cars running on leaded regular gulping twice the amount of fuel that they actually do.

• No emissions rules yet in 1946.

• At least one muffler.

• Only street types (non-race ones) of crossply tires allowed.

• It is 1946, so no aerodynamic devices yet. Offroad skidtray undertray allowed.

• No regulations regarding safety yet.

• Maximum techpool $1.4m (1400K) combined for car and engine. The same techpool should be used for all the cars being sent in. A screenshot of the techpool you intend to use should be sent in for every round, for multiple reasons. Any car not using that techpool will be adjusted to that, which may result in your car behaving differently or losing tech, which ultimately might lead to your brand getting a bad reputation. It is also to keep track of the techpool used between rounds, since you’re not supposed to lower the TP on any point compared to the round before. It will also help if creator has TP passing the limit but host gets a car over the limit, which have happened before.

• Interiors are not mandatory and won’t be judged.

Regulations regarding (visual) car equipment

• The car should have one, symmetrically placed pair of circular headlights, visible straight from the front, placed outside the centerline of the car, lens colour should be white. Placing them behind mesh or cover glass is allowed as long as they are still visible and doesn’t emit illegal colours. Hidden headlights are allowed.
• The car should have at least one taillight, visible straight from the rear. Lens colour should be red. If using only one, it should be placed at the rear left corner of the vehicle. If using more than one, it should be an even number symmetrically placed on each rear corner of the vehicle.
• The car should have at least one brake light, visible straight from the rear. Lens colour should be red. If using only one, it should be placed on the centerline of the car. If using more than one, they should be symmetrically placed on each corner of the vehicle, and in the case of an odd number, one should be placed at the centerline of the car. Combining brake lights and tail lights are allowed.
• Turn signals are highly recommended, but not mandatory. If using them, there should be an even number, symmetrically placed on the corners of the vehicle. Turn signals visible from the front should be white or amber. Turn signals visible from the rear should be red or amber. Combining turn signals with taillights and/or brake lights in the rear is allowed. Semaphores are allowed. Mounting a turn signal fixture on the side of the car visible from both front and rear is allowed.
• One, or a pair of backup lights, are allowed but not mandatory. Lens colour should be white.
• One, or a pair of front fog lights are allowed but not mandatory. Lens colour should be yellow.
• Side marker lights are allowed but not mandatory. Lens colour should be amber.
• The car should have at least one wiper, that is in reach for cleaning the field of vision in front of the driver (in right hand traffic). The only exception are open top cars that does not have a windshield, or where it is obvious that it could be easily folded or removed.
• A rear license plate is required, a front one is allowed. If you want to do them as correct as possible, here is a guide for them, but if someone does not bother it won’t mean any consequences, so it is really just to give the challenge some spice.

1. Take an US size plate

2. Set the colour of the face to “cast alloy” to represent the fact that at least the 1946 plates are really just sheets of cheap recycled metal with loose lettering in phenolic resin.

3. Use this font in embossed black. The plate format is as following:
Letter 1: Region. A= Skärvala, F= Svelmark, L= Ránmark, Q= Kainmark, V = Karsfjell
Letter 2: Any A-Z letter except for “I”.
Number: Up to 3 numbers. If using a lower number, the format is for example “1” or “12”, not “001” or “012”.

Although the license plate thing is mostly for fun…

Details surrounding the submission

• Naming scheme: For car #1, Model / trim name “SOV1A - username / name of the car”. For #2, “SOV1B - uesername / name of the car”. For #3, SOV1C - username / name of the car". Same applies to engine family and variant, except that it should be the name of the engine there.
• An ad should be put up in the thread for all of your cars for the round. It does not have to be complicated, BUT on the other hand a really great ad can boost your brand identity (as well as one that backfires can hurt it).

Details surrounding the bonus submission

• Since the next round will be held in 1952, the trim year has to be between 1946 and 1951.
• More or less the only strict rule is that the object should NOT be a car or light duty commercial vehicle. Vehicles the game aren’t intended to build are OK, as well as other objects (but I will be the judge here, if I find the object unsuitable I will not review it. Adult contents, things that were impossible to produce with the tech of the era, pure nonsense, you get it).
• This is more or less design only since the game is not great at engineering wheelbarrows or toasters. Don’t sweat the engineering.
• The bonus submission does not have to be from a brand related to your car brands.
• An ad is required just like for your cars, and the more challenging to understand what the product is, the more an ad that actually explains it will come in handy.
• The bonus submission should be sent in with the car(s) to be valid. The naming sccheme should be "SOV1X - Username / Name of your product).

Submission start: will be locked in when there has been 48 hours without any discussion about the rules.
Submission end: see above.

[abg7]

This reminds me of long-form, full market-based challenges such as ALC - but with a backstory that begins with secession of the six individual Karvelian states into independent countries, and a specific focus on one of them.

[HyperMud]

I don’t do discord, but I’m going to start a company brand new just for this series!
looking forward to seeing where this goes.

[Knugcab]

Exactly. Generations (which actually finished in both of its iterations), ALC (still ongoing, but since it kind of have shifted focus IIRC I don’t think this will be too close), LHC (that seems to be on a hiatus for an unknown amount of time), this is a similar challenge but it will be ran with my own ideas.

But the general idea is the same. You will play as the same company and try to keep it relevant through the years in this fictive country.

And

@HyperMud

I don’t do discord, but I’m going to start a company brand new just for this series!
looking forward to seeing where this goes.

There is no need to join the discord, so don’t worry, it’s completely volountary.

[mart1n2005]

Sounds alright, I always enjoy legacy challenges. Couple of questions.

• Is it going to be open to basically any kind of vehicle.
• Are you going for a set number (say 10) years between each round.?
• Are you planning on making it a bit more simple than alc and LHC, so like less voting for things and general discussions over rules .

[Knugcab]

1. Well, mainly passenger cars and lighter duty trucks as the game is focusing on…but…there WILL be a twist there (TBA)

2. My thoughts are to RNG the number so it will be a little bit more unpredictable there. But preliminarily I think between 5 and 10 years for the RNG. Shorter than 5 years = we would generally be on the same “generation” of cars and not much time for the country to develop. More than 10 years = there will be a rather large gap both when it comes to how cars and society have developed.

3. In general, yes. Though one of the reason I have put a section about this on my Discord server is for the worldbuilding to be kind of a more collective affair. I kind of both want to make it simpler and at the same time more organic and dynamic.

[Oreology]

This is my first time reading a challenge like this, how does judging work or how do you know a car will sell a lot? How does techpool work or budget or market segmentation or advertising? Like what’s the overall flow like?

[Knugcab]

1. As in any challenge, judging will always be a subjective thing. But the short story is that I will look at how the market evolves, what does the market need and how good does the different cars fulfill that need, and so on. But as I see it, a legacy challenge will never have a true winner. Would anyone try to start an argument that the Porsche 959 was a flop compared to the Talbot Tagora because they sold more Tagoras?

2. My thought is that techpool will evolve from relatively low (to simulate a poor country where fancy cars will cost) to whatever happens to the country. For every round I will probably give more new TP if the economy is strong, and maybe no new TP at all if the economy is really shit.

3. Market segments - well, I have to create them after the cars that gets sent to me, is my POV here at least. If I get one luxury MPV it would absolutely not get a segment on its own. If I get 20 MPVs, where 10 are ultra budget ones and 10 luxury ones, they will really need to get one. So the segments won’t be fixed but evolve over time.

4. Advertising…well a simple ad will work like in any challenge. But I will actually try to mix in brand perception here which might slightly affect your chances (more about that later). A really clever ad might improve your brand perception, maybe just by a little but still. More about that later.

[moroza]

Is the similarity to a relatively well-known Nordwagen model accidental? Or is this likely to sell well when its time comes, because of the similarity?

Does the government have a need for fleet vehicles, whether utility, police, or bureaucrats of varying wheelbase rank?

[Knugcab]

I will leave out the government vehicle part that we saw in LHC because I felt that it was (along with the motorsports part) a thing that would slow it down a little bit too much for me. With that said,if something accidentally seems to align perfectly with what they need it might happen as part of the lore.

As for the name, I had to come up with something else than my original thought since I subconsciously ripped off Tintin there . I was toying around with throwing scandinavian/baltic/finnish-ugric/slavic inspired stuff (notice the word INSPIRED before anyone starts correcting me, this is a fantasy world after all) into a blender for the lore and well, those names were the ones that somehow stuck. As the norseman I am, I think of other stuff than Automation cars if I hear “Valkyrja” anyway

[AMuteCrypt]

To add onto what others have said, ALC has definitely shifted away from what this seems to be. ALC is a challenge about cars and laws. I’ve deliberately removed all the “roleplay as a company and stick with a specific brand” elements because of the direction I wanted to take - but that’s subjective. I’ve excluded cross-round brand perception, familiarity, even the requirement to run the same company in each round. Not for any objective reason, but for subjective ones.

I’d be perfectly happy (and even really interested!) to discuss what your aim and intent is for this going forward - and I’d also love to hear what you think the vision for ALC is too. I definitely think there’s more than enough room for both of these challenges to exist, not a lot of doubt in my mind there, although there isn’t enough articulated here to be able to tell exactly where the gap between our visions is.

Agreed on there being no clear winner for challenges like these. My personal thought on market segments is that it grows somewhat difficult to define the lines. It seems likely that you will end up getting a bit of a spectrum where each car is similar to a couple that are both up and downmarket from it, able to run from econoboxes to premium cars in little chunks of a few hundred here and there. I’ve taken the easy way out of getting folks to answer that question for me, I’ll leave it to you to find your answer.

[mart1n2005]

From an entrant point of view I quite like the way generations had you build three cars for specific market segments.

Makes it easier to compare as a host, and you are “guided” a bit more on what to make.

[Knugcab]

It was maybe an interesting and not even a bad idea. However, it is not how this challenge will be ran.

[Knugcab]

Updated the info section about the country. Also updated the Q&As. If you’re missing something, feel free to ask.

[Knugcab]

Registration form for Story of Velkarja

I have now added a registration form. Fill this in before you enter the challenge. You can register at any time, so if you are unsure about if you maybe want to join this challenge for a later round, take your time. You can also add brands later on - just not replace brands already added.

When it comes to “country of origin”, I will accept:
Real countries

Automationverse countries

Domestic production - BUT, I want this to be used with care. At least if joining early in the game, it is not likely that we would get a whole bunch of domestic brands popping up all at a sudden. Now, if you really want to join in 1946 with domestic production, I won’t stop you, I just want you to think things over. Also remember that there is always an opportunity to start with a foreign brand, but then in later rounds start a new brand for Velkarjan production. Also, to make things fair, I won’t make any difference when it comes to judging domestic and foreign brands.

Neighbouring countries - with the same disclaimer as the domestic production alternative.

Fictive countries - I would probably appreciate a small description about the country in the “other info” section of the sheet then.

What I won’t accept:

Silly claims that “this brand is from hell” or “this brand is from the moon”.

Total nonsense like “this brand comes from Kim Kardashian’s armpit”.

You get it. Relatively free but using common sense.

[Oreology]

I think there should be more worldbuilding or guidelines regarding the game world in total - either Velkarja be a fictional country in the real world, thus players could choose real-life countries to base their brands on, or have Velkarja strictly be in a fictional game world, ideally in another continent in the Automationverse (Hevetsia or Gasmea or whatever but Veklarja is in a new continent with a bunch of new other countries too).

To me it seems weird when you allow players to mix the two? This will also further complicate things as the “story of Velkarja” progresses through the ages - is it going to find its place in a real-world equivalent like is it located in Europe or Northern Asia, or is it playing in a fictional Automationverse world?

I recommend the Automationverse world, with players able to come up with their own countries or I suggest you open up the game world and connect it to Automationverse and define the neighboring countries to Velkarja as well (that new continent idea). Ideally this should stop people from completely just inventing their own countries and ideally help players get a “feel” of what this fictional world is like, and also I feel is more realistic with multiple brands coming from the same countries too.

Right now I understand freedom is good but it would be really hard (imo) to have an idea in my head of what this world looks like and this could help in the story progression going forward (imo).

[Knugcab]

Well, honestly speaking you do have a point. Unfortunately it feels late to change it when I already have allowed a wide array. What is the opinion of other people and especially the ones that have already registered (no idea how many since I am not at the computer ATM).