Automation Legacy Challenge (LOBBYING PART TWO, AND A BONUS ROUND!)



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So, answering the questions which have come in:

@abg7 “How well-developed is the Aragan highway network?” In ALC1, it was not well-developed; in ALC2 and onwards, its state will depend on spending.
@BannedByAndroid “How much does the average Aragan earn? Does the economy on that era is better or worse than the round before?” - Only answering the first one, Araga is slightly more wealthy than the US at the time, with a $4500 average annual wage in 1962 - worth 34200 USD in 2012, which is roughly equal to AMU.
@Fayeding_Spray “What is the largest industry in Aragan [sic]? (excluding automotive industries if applicable)” - Forestry as of ALC1, but tourism is starting to grow larger.
@Elizipeazie “How many people live in Araga and how is the population split between rural and urban?” - 8-9 Million , with a 60/40 Urban/Rural split currently.
@MrdjaNikolen “Are there speed limits on Aragan roads and, if yes, what are values?” - Using road hierarchy terms: 100 on controlled-access and rural/undeveloped, 80 on limited-access and some arterial, 50 on some arterial, all collector and some local, 30 on school zones and some local.
@karhgath “What is the fertility rate in Araga at the start of round 2 in rural and urban areas? (# of children per woman)” - 3.4 overall, high for the era in developed countries but not too high.
@Madrias (Out of sequence, and you’ll see why): “What is the climate like in Araga, regarding temperatures and weather in general?” The climate is Köppen CSA, also known as “typical Mediteranian” equivalent to Los Angeles, Valencia, Rome, Perth and such.
@Petakabras “What´s the average Aragan driver´s opinion towards convertibles? (Not at all, soft or hard tops, perhaps targa roofs?)” - Warm days and dry summers means it’s a yes.
@interior “How frequent do the people of Araga take public transport over privately-owned cars?” - During ALC1, not much at all as the system (like the highway system) is rudimentary. Walking and bicyles are popular options, although dependent on models of development. If it is improved, usage will increase.
@TheYugo45GV “What are the average road distances and travel times between Argara’s major cities?” - Around 4-500 km, or 4-5 hours at highway speed.
@carpotato7 “Is there developed car culture in Argara [sic] yet?” - There is a nascent and emerging modification culture, but that’s it.
@GassTiresandOil “How much of Araga’s topography is covered in woodlands/forests?” - Most of it, as forestry is a major industry.
@Restomod “How is the Aragan government run (republic, dictatorship, direct fucking democracy, ogligarchy) and what is the public opinion of the current government?” - Parliamentary Democracy. Opinion is fairly low, as it is in all democracies.
@ldub0775 “What does Araga economy look like? ie. what do they import/produce, what real life economy does it resemble, how high is the GDP, etc.” - Not gonna give high numbers, but GDP is reasonably high. Exports include wood, tourism, education, tow trucks…
@ChemaTheMexican “Are there any local Aragan auto-manufacturers or heavy industries that could easily switch to producing cars? If so, are they ran by the government? or are they Autonomous?” - Yes to local ones, because I don’t wanna step on anyone’s lore. The government ones cannot easily switch, due to red tape.
@lotto77 “What are the demographics of Araga like? IE what’s the split between working, middle, and upper classes.” - Gini Coefficient of 0.34, relatively low disparities between classes.
@Edsel “What is the history of Araga? i.e. How did the government, borders, and identity of Araga become what they are today?” - Waaaaaay too broad.
@cake_ape “How safety conscious are Aragans in general? On a scale of “but muh freeduhm to die on teh hiways” to “let’s bubble-wrap this rubber ball”.” At the start of ALC2, not particularly safety conscious.
@Knugcab “How are the urban areas when it comes to space for cars? Is it like old, cramped, crowded cities built without cars in mind (= less space for maneuvering, parking, more traffic jams) or are they car “friendly” with large parking spaces, roads planned for cars etc.?” - Will depend on development, wait and see.
@kalan “Oh, that’s an interesting problem. What is the city more like: New York or Detroit?
Or Chicago or Los Angeles?” - Not asking something specifically addressable, also depends on development.
@Quneitra “What is the average age of a car buyer? For example, is there an economic boom leading to lots of youth buying cars, or is mostly in the realms of the middle aged?” For new cars, it’s mostly middle aged.

In theory, you all have 4 hours to submit final lobbying; some of you may have been waiting to submit lobbying, so I will extend it to Saturday the 28th of May, at 11:59 PM UTC. You have 28 hours.

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Yeah, I knew this was gonna be a hard question to word.

If I were to clarify what I meant by this question, such as by giving “example answers” for real countries, would you still be willing to answer it?

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Could I theoreticaly lobby for public transport and then start submitting trams and buses? It would take some HUGE changes to Somboy’s lore, but it’s a fun idea.


Edit: To clarify, that’s a yes to entering busses, not to re-asking a question.

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Round Two: Prologue Lobbying Review

Unlike reality, very few manufacturers favoured urban sprawl; some even actively pushed against it. Instead, there was broad consensus in favour of higher development - either satellite cities, or large condensed ones. It’s a close battle, but I’m going to give the win to 1.3: Satellite Cities - albeit with elements of both. Araga’s cities are densely populated, with much parking located in multi-level or underground structures; they are modern cities designed with modern ideas, and work rather well for cars.

Both options in the second category can succeed at once. Let’s check 2.2 first.

Over half of the people who lobbied supported better highways. That’s a lot - and with satellite cities, highways become more and more essential. 2.2: My Way Or The Highway passes with flying colours. Just about every major or minor settlement is accessible via a paved, well-maintained road. Off-roading is the realm of hobbyists, farmers and lumberjacks.
The support for public transit, meanwhile, was a bit more tepid… But moving to satellite cities at this point in the life cycle of the automobile means I’m ignoring lobbying and having 2.1: The Public Option succeed too. This means rail links between the cities, and a strong network of busses and trams to link everywhere else - both within the cities, and for that last mile not on the rail network.

Three options only saw interest from a couple of manufacturers; these are 3.1, 3.3 and 3.6. Oval racing suffers hard from a lack of manufacturer involvement, with both manufacturers involved showing a token effort. Ovals simply aren’t built here. It’s dead, Jim. Drag racing has a little more support, but the beauty of it is that it doesn’t need support. People just continue on, a quarter mile at a time. Formula One, meanwhile? Well, you can thank Winsley for it existing in Araga. They went all out, building a track for it and managing, in 63, to attract entries for a non-championship race. How that evolves remains to be seen.

A moderate success is 3.2: Roads? How Boring!. Despite a smear campaign focussing on the danger of racing on public roads, rallies remain popular. Araga is one of the first places to implement rallies consisting solely of special stages for competition. Just don’t try it at home.

Finally, we come to the big winners - 3.4: He’s Going The Distance and 3.5: The Grand Tour. Endurance racing enjoyed considerable support, and touring car racing was more popular than highways (although with less money). Araga sees a dazzling array of manufacturers involved, with a wide variety of road-like cars. Track days are increasingly popular too, as the many tracks need to fill time. Winsley Circuit Araga was broken in by touring cars too, before it attracted those open-wheelers. Many drivers frequently cross between the two, becoming superstars in the process.

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ERA 2: '55-'64.

This era ends in 64, because unleaded fuel unlocks in 65. It will close on the 20th of June at 11:59 PM UTC - extended marginally due to the fact that I have exams. Also, remember: Even if you didn’t enter round one, you can still enter this round.

Safety Regulations and fixture requirements:

All regulations are set as they were in ALC1, with two major requirements.

  • No safety requirement
  • Headlights: at least one pair, round lenses are most common
  • Turn signals: must be visible when looking directly at the front and rear of the car; side-mounted ones are not required but can be used (edit: in place of front- and rear-mounted ones) for this so long as they are visible. Light-based turn signals must be orange. Semaphore-style indicators are allowed.
  • Tail lights: at least one pair required. Must be red and must use different bulbs to the brake light.
  • Brake lights: at least one pair. Must be red and must use different bulbs to the tail lights.
  • Reversing lights: not required.
  • All legally mandated lights facing forward or back: At least one set must be visible from the head of the dummy in the
    Light Visibility Measure-inator, at a distance of 2m from front bumper to rear bumper. The Measure-inator uses the crash dummy and cheap seats mods. (CHANGED FROM PREVIOUS ERA)
  • Mirrors: not required.
  • Gas cap: not required - some cars had the gas cap inside the lights.
  • Wipers: one wiper required on the front.
  • License plate: Any (unscaled) plate will be allowed, as there are no standards yet.

Other Regulations

  • Emissions and efficiency requirements: None
  • Fuel availability: Regular (92 RON) and Super (98 RON) leaded available.
  • Tyres: Radials and Cross-ply tyres are equally common. 80-90% Profile tyres are considered “standard”, with 75% available; any major deviations from that are slightly suspect. (CHANGED FROM PREVIOUS ERA)
  • Name your model and family ALC2 - YourForumName.
  • Vehicle Taxation: Moderate displacement-based taxes have been introduced, and will range from 200-800 AMU ish. The amount of tax paid is based on displacement in CC: Tax=1.5^(displacement/1000)*150 - and you must pay triple this when you buy your car. A graph of it can be found here - set d (for displacement) to your value to find out what level of taxes consumers will pay. Tax represents annual tax, buy represents extra paid when buying the car. What this means is that smaller engines pay around 2-300 dollars per year, larger engines will be 6-800 per year. Vans and utes, with dedicated non-passenger spaces around 40% of the length or more, will be treated as if their engines are 2000 CC smaller. The Centara, WCV, Garland, Somboy, Fitz and Centurion all qualify here. Note that if a car is fixtured with fewer seats than it is specced with, I’ll be upset. Very upset. I’ll also reserve the right to tweak the stats of wagons fixtured into vans/utes, but they may be legal. Offroad vehicles, defined as having 40 offroad or higher, will be treated as if their engines are 1000 CC smaller. These two stack.

Market Sentiment

  • People are absolutely willing to modify their cars. Commercial buyers are doing it a lot, and regular sedan buyers are doing maintenance themselves. Cars with good options for modification, like variant capacity lower than family capacity, roomy engine bays and such may be better received than normal.
  • People don’t care about displacement at all. It didn’t bring anything positive previously, either for performance or for high-torque engines being useful commercially. Of course, if displacement does give something…
  • People are skeptical about expensive cars, given that the price bump didn’t give much in the past.
  • Customers want more unique and unusual cars, especially at the expensive and sporty end. This is especially true given the desire for vibrant colours.
  • Customers want cars with spare capacity in terms of maximum RPM and torque.

Current Events

  • 1955-1964 (Whole Era) - Broadcast In Wonderful Technicolor: Araga hopped on the colour television trend early, with initial broadcasts starting in 1955 and proliferating out from there. This means that cars with vibrant colours are more popular and easier to sell, with the effect growing stronger as the era goes on. However - as much as this pains me to do - I’m going to ask you to be restrained with your use of pearl, for historical reasons. It wasn’t something which OEMs could feasibly do in this era, IRL.
  • 1962-1964 - Unsafe At Many Speeds: A round of official reports has come out investigating road fatalities, and it has found that certain cars, lacking any safety devices at all, have led to countless deaths. These cars range from budget sedans to hard-working commercial vehicles. This became a major issue, and the public is much more safety-conscious in the last 4 years of the era.

Lobbying Opportunities

The next era will run from 1965-1972 (edit note: Shortened a year further to allow all QFC2 cars to come in one wave. Not set to 72 due to oil crisis, this is set so that MPEFI unlocks at the start of ALC5.)

  • Emissions and efficiency rules will not be brought in yet.
  • There is a spectrum of lobbying options for leaded fuel bans. Knowledge of the toxicity of lead (although not tetraethyllead) was definitely well known, and the prevalence of environmental lead due to TEL was shown by the early 50s.
    1. Complete and immediate ban, with leaded fuel completely banned from 1965. Fuel quality issues may manifest in the early years of the era, and lower octanes may be required.
    2. Gradual switchover, with leaded fuel banned and slowly withdrawn, controlled and eventually banned. Generates an odd middle ground of fuel availability, may force people to replace leaded cars earlier than desirable.
    3. No actions. Nothing happens, but environmental issues may occur...
    Submit a number between 1 and 9 for this lobbying. 1 represents supporting a full ban, 5 represents a gradual switchover, 9 represents no actions. A number of, say, 4, represents support for a gradual switchover but a preference for a full ban over inaction.
  • Taxes may be lobbied once more. There are three different ways you can lobby:
    1. You can lobby for a second metric on tax. The options are adding a luxury, footprint or weight-based tax, or you can lobby against additional tax metrics. This option will not increase the average tax paid per car.
    2. You can lobby for taxes to be much higher than they currently are, somewhat higher than they currently are, where they currently are, lower than they currently are, or much lower than they currently are. This will be accomplished by changing the value of L (the Level of tax) on the graph.
    3. You can lobby for taxes to scale more, stay where they are, or scale less. More scaling means taxes go down for small engines but up for large engines; the opposite is true for less scaling. No matter what, large engines will still pay more than small ones. This will be accomplished by changing the value of S (the Scaling of the tax) on the graph.

Lobbying for leaded fuel and taxes will not cause diminished effect. Lobbying in 2 of the tax categories will reduce effectiveness to 75%; lobbying in 3 categories will reduce effectiveness to 55%. Lobbying for multiple tax metrics will split power up equally between them.

Example: Alice only lobbies for higher scaling. Bob lobbies for Luxury and weight taxes, higher taxes and lower scaling. Charlie lobbies for no new metrics and lower taxes. “No new metrics” has 0.7 lobbying power, “Luxury” and “Weight” each have 0.25, “Higher taxes” has 0.5, “Lower taxes” has 0.7, “Lower scaling” has 0.5, “Higher scaling” has 1.

Spending tokens will return, between rounds. I quite enjoyed the breathing room, so I’ll be keeping it. If you could have had spending tokens, but did not use them, you will get an extra 50% lobbying power and 2 tokens (rather than the 100% extra and 3 tokens available if you actively engaged with it.) This applies equally to the two categories of lobbying.

Finally, we have the option for write-in lobbying. You can request up to three rules added or tweaked, provided they are not mentioned above. I will either ignore your suggestion, implement it, or add it to a future lobbying round (between or during an era).

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So if I’m understanding correctly, no matter how large your engine is, your tax will never be higher than 2000 AMU? And inversely no matter how small, it’ll never go lower than 500?

And is that final value is added, 3-fold, to whatever your car’s upfront cost is? Or is there also something we add to service costs?

Edit: the safety current event lists itself from 1962-1964 (3 years), but in the brief mentions applying to the last 4 years of the era. Is that an error, or am I missing something?

Edit #2: In the last round, lobbying for/against more than one thing reduced effectiveness of lobbying overall. In the case of this round, does your lobbying regarding lead fuel impact your lobbying power regarding taxes, and vice versa?

In theory, taxes can be as low as 160 AMU (minimum size i3) and as high as 223,500 AMU (maximum size V16); those numbers are for the typical-sized engine.

It’s added to the service cost and to the upfront cost, multiplied by 3 for upfront.

The safety is a typo.

I will edit in a part on how vote spreading works.

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The link to your graph defaults to 1.4^(displacement/1000)*400

This may need fixing

Yes and yes, slight apologies - I swapped between a lump-sum only and annual one, oops.

I’m not sure I understand how to interpret and use this rule. So if I put the camera at the end of the 2 m measuring tape and look at the car head (or tail) on, then I must be able to see the lights as well as the head of the dummy?

Put your car and the Measure-inator (rip, another typo) in the same photoscene. Set your car up with the 2M gap shown. Put the camera into the dummy’s head, poking through just far enough to see out of it. See if you can spot the lights.

Edit: Looks like this. with @cake_ape 's Collis Celer, Measurinator in the middle. Camera goes inside the dummy’s head.

Edit 2: Because this isn’t an exact science, if I can see the lights from any point inside the dummy’s head, it’s legal.
Final edit: If your car is illegal on lights, I’ll let you know and allow you to fix it.


Regarding pearl: No, it is absolutely not era correct. It was used on a few custom cars at the very end of this era, but the thing is that it was not available as automotive paint, only as nail paint. Yup, you guessed right, to paint your car with pearl, buying tons of nail paint bottles was what you had to do. Do I need to say that it was not really feasible to paint a mass produced car in pearl? :rofl:


Final note, I swear. Write-in lobbying has been added to the post.


When the Saarland Adjunkt was released in 1962, probably more than one eyebrow was raised. Not because of the fact that an entry level model was introduced below the Bischof and the top of the range Kardinal - it was only a natural addition. But Saarland was an early adopter of the transverse front wheel drive formula - something not excepted from a company that generally made very conservative vehicles.

It was not exactly a decision out of the blue, though. The Adjunkt was a clean sheet design that shared absolutely nothing with the larger Saarlands. During development, both longitudinal and transverse FWD was considered, as well as RWD with front- and rear engines.

The traditional FR layout had its drawbacks in the transmission tunnel taking up room, as well as needing either a heavy solid axle or expensive IRS in the rear. It also had the drawback in such a light car that it would not put enough weight over the drive wheels, making it less suited for bad road conditions. The RR layout was seen by Saarland as a dead end in automobile evolution, and would not be viable as a concept to engineer future models on. Longitudinal FWD would not have allowed for an engine that could be bored up to larger displacements, which meant that the design would have been less “future proof”. That left the transverse FWD as the most viable alternative - and judging by the engineering of modern superminis, they were probably onto something.

Combined with the column mounted shifter and umbrella handbrake, both allowing for a flat floor, this gave a bit of an airy feeling to the relatively cramped cabin. But despite the futuristic engineering, this was a simple car. Not much in the way of equipment, a relatively straightforward 1 litre 39 hp OHV inline four under the hood, double wishbone suspension up front while the rear axle was the simplest you could think of - a tube connecting the wheels, hung with leaf springs under the car. Hardly a cozy highway cruiser - more ideal as a nippy city runabout.

A car for Aragans? Well, that’s what we’re going to find out…


So is the measurement tool to get the headlights height at the right level? And not a distance thing

Place the rulers in the measurement tool so that the end of them intersects with the furthest back (or front) point of your car. Place the camera inside the dummy. Move your camera around to check.

The tool is for distance and camera height.

I’m not saying the light tool rule shouldn’t exist or that I’m opposed to it. But considering how annoying I find the camera mode is to use I’ll probably wing it and hope for the best. It’s not likely that a normally designed car will break this particular rule anyway.

First of all, it is decently likely that a regularly designed car will break the rule. The measure-inator has a long front and rear, and high suspension; this means that cars with realistic low-positioned lights and low suspensions (y’know, most sports cars and some sedans) do break the rule. Plenty of perfectly sensible cars from ALC break the rule. Consider it the 5 MPH bumper/sealed beam of Araga - a somewhat flawed rule with decent intent which forces classic designs to be changed.

On another note (not gonna call it final this time) - I’m going to ask anyone working on a non street-legal race car to pause construction and hold off on submitting for at least the next 24 hours, as I may run a slight change to this round.