I see, I mean I still need to check with my engineering test mule since I don’t fully understand al rima and stuff. However, I am a bit iffy with the budget but maybe 100k max is too low for the type of cars people wanna make.
2 Likes
I’m having an awful time trying to find inspiration with the few bodies currently available for this challenge. Do you think there may be some leeway in perhaps letting the model year unlock go to 1945 and just judging for period correctness?
I’m pretty sure I know what the customer is looking for (at least aesthetically). I’m just having a tough time with the limited selection.
These few bodies are extremely flexible and you can do a lot 
No, I don’t think expanding the model year unlock will help in design - if you look at the inspiration section there is a certain aesthetic that the client likes.
Several years ago, there is a CSR similar to this, of which basically you only had 3 bodies too.
Since then, we’ve got 2 new bodies (you can use the Sochaux [unlocked in 1940] or Rolls Royce body [unlocked in 1945] ), 2D offset, and a couple more fixtures that you can use, so if anything it’s a bit more easier now too to make things like this.
I would like to take the time now to highlight and appreciate these nice cars that people made, 3 years ago, built in an era with less features, fixtures and less bodies:
Even with this field, there is a lot of diversity in design. 
Good luck!
Also - any others want to voice their opinions on the techpool or budget?
9 Likes
I believe the budget may still be too high.
with this techpool here and then including +8 quality nearly everywhere (trim body, engine family, interior and suspension are all +15) and the final cost is still under 100k AMU
The engineering is still WIP but I do still think a $200k budget is a bit overkill, reducing it to 100-150k will still allow for very high-priced entries but is more reasonable imo.
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150k would be the lowest i’d go. What wheelbase and engine did you use? Those make a decent difference in budget. There needs to be space for that level(or higher imo) of quality usage on the more complicated engines too.
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using the 3.38m Merlin, with an all iron 6.3L V12 with forged crank. The pistons and conrods are cast heavy.
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Budget Update:
Hello, after testing out some mules I think I will lower the budget to $140k and move ‘cost’ up two priority levels to level 3 (so its not something you just max out willy-nilly and encourages a more varied engineering field, from cars that look and feel prestigious enough but still have good value as opposed to cars that are balls-to-the-wall extreme maxed out everything - just make sure the car looks really luxurious though)
[Tyres] Since no one talked about this yet:
- Because it was hard to mandate realistic tyre sizes for different bodies and types of cars, I will just use the profile of the tyre itself, and let the bodies determine max width and max diameter or size (I will try to roughly look at the tyre and see if it’s realistic or not -ish for the era - please look at references).
- Allowed Tire Profile Range: 80 to 90, found here below: “P155/ 85 C20”, between the “/” and “C”.
- Cross Ply only.
Tyre ATS:
(banned):
- Wheel Width
- Wheel Diameter
- Tyre Diameter
(allowed):
- Everything Else
Just as a reminder, these ATS (Body, Visibility, Engine) is all allowed.
5 Likes
Epicsauce
I’d personally push for this to go down to 70. Some of the 30s vehicles I’ve seen in person, specifically Voisins. tend to run a lower profile tyre.
Silver car is my own. the black car is a 1935 Voisin C28 Clairière. They’re similar enough in in rim to tyre proportion. The Voisin is also a few years old at the point the round is set, so having this slightly lower profile be allowed isn’t beyond the realm of realism. A range of 70 - 90 sidewall is reasonable for this era, especially with how big cars can get.
3 Likes
Rim size has nothing to do with aspect ratio. While the sidewalls are quite small relative to the rim, those are also pizza-cutter narrow. Large diameters were common - 17-21 and up - but I’ve never found a pre-war tire with a sidewall less than 75% of actual width. And believe me, I looked.
1935 Voisin C30, according to this, used 6.50/7.00-17 with 31.22" (793mm) OD and 194mm actual width, which is wider than the nominal 7" tread width. Even then, ((31.22-17)/2)/(194/25.4) = .93
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I was talking about visual proportions. I was looking at what automation was giving as the sidewall on a build I had done similar to the C28 and they visually matched well. The Automation value for sidewall that was on my build was 70 and it looks close to what the C28 example has. Automation has some slight wonkiness in what it will call different sidewall numbers. Also no they are not pizza cutter thin. I’d put them at close to 155s in game.
From the side, yes, I agree that’s a close match. But what’s in question here takes width and OD into account. Your width is fine but OD much smaller - 710 vs 793.
Automation tires do look a bit bloated, you’re right.
(I just discovered that OD can be finetuned)
Related to this and other concerns about accurately representing 1930s cars in Automation, an open request to @Oreology : please discuss any demerits, bins, or other concerns regarding finer points of realism with entrants before finalizing judging. While some things have been formally ruled on, others just plain obvious, and entrants should do their part in asking questions, it’d be best if the reviews didn’t include any surprises. Some of the fine points brought up here by @Portalkat42 and others are legitimate grey areas that warrant further research, others weighing in, or are just matters of opinion that should be agreed upon before any salt can be poured.
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Tyre Profile Sidewall
- Okay, I can extend the range to 70-90 sidewall, as cars in this luxury range did have large rims. As for the width or sidewall, there’s no real good way to check in-game without spending a lot of time on it and at the end of the day, just make it visually look correct please. (And this tyre sidewall rule will help towards that)
Demerits/Bins/Realism:
- Don’t be too ambitious in engineering? I don’t think minmaxxing or statsmaxxing helps, at the end of the day it’s a holistic judging with everything in consideration. I don’t foresee any gruesome bins based on realism unless its weird. As for design, there’s no real preference towards any specific shape or type, but just make it look visually coherent and appealing, with no weird proportions or weird spots. I don’t know what else to really say.
Interior:
- I think I will mandate a nice interior (not just basic seats + steering wheel), especially since I saw a few builds are going the open-top route. Any inputs on this? Also, I don’t expect a TON of intricate little details, just make it visually nice and not too basic, but extra little details will help score to reflect the extra effort.
3 Likes
The tire thing is kind of interesting as always in old car challenges. Crossplies generally had 100 profile until lower ones started to appear in the 60s, but aesthetically Automation makes cars with such high profiles appear rather swamp buggy like….
2 Likes
Personally, I’m all for thorough interior judging. Out of consideration for others who’re less enthusiastic about them, I propose the “readily visible from outside” guideline, or perhaps a notch or two above that. This would mean that open tops are held to a higher standard than something with gunslits.
1935 Daimler Double Six
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comeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetitcomeandgetit
Submissions now open
rules are set
1930's Luxury coupes
◆
Final Rules (in addition to existing)
◆ Soychaux body allowed (“Soychaux”)
◆ Rolls Royce body allowed ('45 Merlin)
◆ Full 3D Builds allowed
◆ interiors required (medium-quality: not just basic seats and steering wheel)
◆ 2 Front Seats only (only 2 seater, no +2)
◆ reverse-flow mufflers allowed
◆ Forged engine internals allowed
◆ License Plate is required - just white letters and numbers on a black bar, look at inspirations
◆ Rhd/lhd free, up to you
◆ banned ats settings (wheel width, wheel diameter, tyre diameter)
◆ allowed ats settings (visibility, body, everywhere else)
◆ tyre wheel width and size is free game, only limited by profile: 70-90 profiles only.
◆ V16s Allowed
◆ final techpool: 80m
◆ final budget: 140k amu
◆ ‘price’ now a 3-star priority (moved up 2 levels)
notes / thoughts
Not sure what else to include other than these. i will add these rules to the existing post. anything else goes under ‘realism’ and ‘engineering sense’. you can check out the inspiration cars for realistic power numbers or acceleration figures or check chatgpt or gemini if you want a quick realism check.
by ‘medium quality’ interiors i meant more than just a basic seat and steering wheel. in the interior mods for this time era i found a bunch of doorcards and dashboards and i feel it should be easy enough to make a medium-quality interior.
by ‘realism’ or ‘engineering’ no need to be too quirky or ambitious in design/engineering, just a high quality and well-executed design with well tuned engineering is more than enough to be good.
merci beaucoup
◆ Submissions open today. (wednesday, january 28)
◆ Submissions close monday, february 16. (countdown) (2.8 weeks later)
◆
11 Likes
Tire profile max 90? When typical ones were 100+? Or is that to compensate for Automation’s visual bloatiness with tires?
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Yes but also no one else mentioned anything else so I thought it was fine, regardless the rules have been set so 
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Hello guys, just received a DM regarding this question - fuel fillers in the boot trunk (if you choose to do so) are fine.
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