Damn, I suspected that my cheap suspension setup might bite me, but only that made realistic sense in this car 
Should’ve entered sth else than a PZS, but I’m still satisfied with the result for what it is.
Very happy with the top 10 finish. Also happy to begin to shake the reputation of unreliability. Much luck to the finalists!
I lived in a community with two and a half Peugeot 504, all late 70’s to early 80’s - an NA diesel wagon with an automatic, a turbodiesel sedan with a 4-speed manual, and a parts sedan. The wagon was utterly excremental to drive, while the sedan was rather fun, quite comfortable, and oozed character. Despite a lackadaisical maintenance regime, short on funds as much as attention and care, they were as reliable as anything that old, maybe not quite Mercedes or Hilux levels, but well above average and a solid debunk to the French unreliability stereotype. The fact that the 504 remained in production as late as 2006 (Nigeria, I think) and is still a common sight in the “developing” world suggests that my experience with them was not a fluke.
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WOAH, 8TH? WOAH
Thanks for the feedback, i definitely appreciate it.
Progressive and talked about but also hated design for mine, very conflicted towards the Wren? Nonetheless I’m happy with a top ten, I could have spent longer but I am still kinda burnt out
Second to last, at least it wasn’t instabinned; I figured the styling was going to be the make it or break it. It does make me feel better that the safety was a (good) standout.
I am frankly disappointed with 26th but I guess its better than the bin like usual
20th is not too bad. At least it was being considered.
THE TEST DRIVES
“Hola Sergio, my car won´t move… DAMN.”
“No wonder, the clutch is finally burned…”
“Oh, I will call us a taxi then. It looks like you sold your car?”
“Yes, I need the money to move out… my mother is right about that. But I guess we can take her Rigel, and since it has a Diesel engine, driving would be cheaper. But I drive, not you… the clutch is brand new.”
The first dealership on the way was the Nordwagen. A monumental building looking like a gothic cathedral. A blonde man with strict facial expression welcomened them. “Hello, I am Hans. You called for the Kümmerling?”
“That´s right. I see, it is ready for us. Anything we need to know?”
“Nope”, said Hans. “It has only minimal electronic entertainment stuff, since we focus on the driving itself. But you won´t be bored. It has a style unmatched by the competition.”
“The car is a good example of retro design, it looks like some exclusive car from the 1930s, and rather ice-cold… very nordic.”
“Yes”, said Hans, not without pride. “It might be exotic here in Spain, but this car follows consequently the idea. Nordwagen represents old values that have been lost over the time.”
The interior showed few hard plastic. Leather and real walnut wood with beautiful retro instrumentation awaited them. An hour later, they returned to the dealer.
“So, how was it, Senor Ignacio?”
“It was really a nice ride, it is very secure and we refilled not much gas. And it feels extremely solid. Typical nordic build quality, I guess. What is the price and how much is servicing?”
“It is yours for 18.500 Euro, and servicing is 612,40 a year.”
“Thats both not much, considering what we got here, thanks, Hans.”
The next dealership was the Clari.
“Damn, what kind of… things are on this parking spot?”
“Abuelo, this is the model.”
“You are joking?”
“Nope. At least try it out.”
Sofia, the nice young lady from the dealership explained everything, starting from the low 18.100 price tag to rather affordable servicing and even the standard AWD drive. Drivability and comfort were even better than the Nordwagen, and it needed almost no fuel despite the AWD drive - only 4,7 liter. It even moved with more effort than the rather heavy-feeling Nordwagen. The orthopedic seats were a class of its own, and the suspension ironed out almost every bump like it was air suspension.
“Did it please you?”, asked Sofia with a shy smile.
“When I close my eyes, yes, but unfortunately, I have to keep them open while driving.”
“Umm, but you sit at least inside of it.”
“I will think about it, senorita.”
In front of the Swanson dealer parked something looking great - the 112 Bocanegra.
“Swanson, what do you know about it? I thought they made giant VWs that drove great and nobody knew why.”
“Yes, since these days, a Swanson was always a car for individualists. Even a Primus is rather usual compared to them. But they knew what they are doing.”
Alvaro, the young salesman with jeans and sneakers, was very surprised that a senior like Ignacio wanted to test drive the youthful car, but happily waved with the keys.
“Oh-ooooohhh. this thing is responsive.”
“How is the handling?”
“As the car looks. It is fresh and sporty both the interior and exterior, and it is very nimble. It is the total opposite of the Nordwagen, but not bad.”
“So… which one do you prefer?”
“Well, the seats are harder, and it is less space in here, but it is more fun to drive and needs less fuel. And despite all the light weight, every part is rock solid!”
He grabbed and slammed some interior parts. “Best quality!”
“So… lets ask for the price?”
“20.000”, said Alvaro, “but it is worth it!”.
“It is a good car, no doubt, but 20k is a lot for a small car, even if it was a joy to drive. I will think about it!”
Next on the list was the Heimat dealer. A white cubic block sterile as a emergency room.
“Those Germans really need to relax more”.
“Ignacio, we are here for the car, not the dealership”.
Rüdiger, a German immigrant, greeted them with a firm handshake.
“So, you called for the Toehn?”
“Yep. That is it?”
“Sure, the car speaks for itself so I might be something you can rationalize”, he laughed. “But I will answer you any question.”
“Since it is German I expect it to be efficient?”
“The most efficient of its class, with only 4,2 liter in consumption. Since we are efficient all around, it is even cheap to service. And would the gentlemen like to check the reliability record?”
“That is definitely impressive. How much is it?”
“So-equipped 18.500 Euro.”
“Alright! We need the keys!”
“Almost no other car combines being really modern with such a distinguished design, not a single line misplaced, what a pleasure to look at!”
“Is it also a pleasure to drive, Ignacio?”
“It handles not as good as the Nordwagen when it comes to the feel of a heavy car, and it is not so nimble like the Swanson. It is similar to the Clari, but the road feel is number. But this is all still on an excellent level.”
“How about the comfort?”
“Not as good as the Clari, better than the Swanson. Lets hand it back, we have one candidate left.”
“Hello Santiago, is our car ready?”
“The Korssen K20 is waiting for you, senor.”
“Oh, a station wagon. That is something we did not have yet.”
“It looks modern, but not overdone. A pleasant design, but not as innovative as a Swanson, not as sculptured as a Heimat Toehn, not as unique as a Nordwagen, but definitely bettter than a Clari. The price?”
“18.500, and 849 Euro annual service.”
“That is more service cost than the aforementioned. We read about minor reliability inconveniences, too.”
“Yes, but they are REALLY minor. Still above average. Maybe you want to test drive it?”
“Of course, it looks promising anyway.”
“Plenty of space in here, and the seats are as good as in the Clari. Still some buttons left which I like. But these small symbols on that computer…”
Sergio zoomed with two fingers.
“Ah, now they are extra large. How practical! But why did they mount the armrest in the wrong direction? Must be a prototype, I guess.”
It was perfectly comfortable, secure and fun to drive, more fun than the Toehn, affordable for what it offered and needed not too much fuel.
“Santiago, this was really nice. I will surely think about that, its a nice car you offer.”
In the evening, Sergio and Ignacio picked two cars that do not make it to the finals.
“The Clari, definitely. I mean, it drove so nice, but …”
“Yes, you don´t need to explain. And which one is also out?”
“The Swanson. It is more for young guys like you. A top class car, but it´s too much spaceship for me and I don´t need its sportiness, and in terms of Comfort the other four were better.”
Rank 5 with 117,61 points: Swanson 112 Bocanegra by @Ludvig
Although scoring 9,5 out of 10 in terms of design (it is really well made with tons of details, and I did not even judge the perfectly fitting interior), it falls behind when it comes to comfort and price. The others managed to have similar stats while staying in or below the soft limit of 18,5k. Nevertheless a brilliant entry.
Rank 4 with 118,24 points: Clari Eau d Aigu by @Vento
I am a 100 percent honest now: Unlike almost all other hosts, I made design a two-star priority to give especially you a chance. I feel sorry for you since your engineering is almost unbeatable but your cars archieve the impossible and are uglier than a Fiat Multipla. You could have won this time, if it wasnt the bad design. I let you score 3,5 out of 10 for the design together with the BetterDeals since I feel like you deserved entering the semifinals this time. When I will find the time, I will do some design improvements on your car, and make a documentation of that, we can fix this issue!
So, the finals are:
Korssen K20 by @Kevin980
Nordwagen Kümmerling by @moroza
Heimat Toehn by @vouge
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Happy with 5th in this company.
Nice CSR QFC, with an evidently popular, and well written brief, keep the good times rolling
The name references the classic SEAT 1200 Sport, and is simply a spanish flavored special edition. Until the strongly worded letters from VAG lawyers came in…
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Im finding it hard to read with the way that text is set out, would it be possible to make it clearer what car is being talked about at what time (like maybe bold text to specify where it starts)
My cutest and most cheerful design still manages to be ice-cold… lovely. And fitting, I suppose. I expected to have stronger engineering and weaker styling, but not complaining. Cheers for the lore nods.
The head engineer at Nordwagen, Dr. Ing. Panzerstrudelüberprüfungsmeßermeier von Neunschwanzstein, threw a hissy fit upon hearing of comfort and drivability being beaten without huge compromises elsewhere. Following an unscheduled break involving a straitjacket, they left work early, making a beeline for the nearest Clari dealership, armed with $18.1k in cash and a large set of wrenches.
I’m not one who likes to salt, or harsh the mellow of a challenge, but I feel the point-based scoring of this challenge has heavily hampered the “feel” of a challenge like this.
Like, I would very much like to see what system/method you used to come up with the results of this, considering some of the entries that scored well here I have concerns about the efficacy of this judging system when comparing to other equivalent challenges.
I just have concerns relating to some of the cars that have ended up within the top 10, myself included.
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Maybe if the rules and expectations regarding distinct competiton types were written down somewhere easily found? I got pretty salty in CSR154 over the same thing, which is apparently a systematic problem.
What are your concerns?
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TBH, when getting this many entries in a challenge that is supposed to be “quick”, spreadsheet judging is the way to go - and it also tends to make results less subjective, more objective. Sure, if one car gets 90 points (to just say a number) and another one 90.2, it could be worth looking into which one that fits the brief the best and watch out for stats cheese, but if three cars get 75, 90 and 105 points, their ranking is probably quite clear anyway…
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THE FINALS
Granada, May 2018
“Hola abuelo!”, said Sergio, waving to Ignacio who sat in his garden, studying car brochures.
“Have you slept over the impressions?”
“Yes, I did”, said Ignacio, and he signaled his young neighbour to come over.
“Listen, since you helped me so much with gardening, renovations and all that technical stuff, and I never paid something, it is finally time to give you something back. Here are the keys for the Astrona.”
“Oh, you do not need to pay me, I will do it for free, as always, you just need to pay for the parts.”
“I dont mean that.” The old man shook the hand of his young friend. “Since you always liked it since you were a little boy, and you kept it in great condition, it is finally the day to pass it on to you, since you had to sell your own for the deposit of your first apartment.”
Sergio cried tears of joy, since this Astrona was still worth 5.000 Euro in mint condition and with low miles like this, and despite all the abuse, abuelo made sure the car was perfectly maintained, so despite some scratches and the dead clutch, the Primus was fine. Abuelo even listened to Sergio and let the car idling for 10 minutes before driving off, to have the oil warm when Ignacio revved to the sky.
“And I have made my descision.”
“Who to call? Santiago?”
“No, let me tell you why.”
Rank 3 with 121,38 points: Korssen K20 by @Kevin980
The Korssen pleased with outstanding comfort and had solid stats all around. The design was scored with 7,5 out of 10. Even if I rated it 8, which I considered as well, it still had higer service cost and less reliability than the other two finalists. However, this car managed to top both in comfort and drivability while making not much compromises elsewhere. The podium is deserved.
Looking at the remaining two brochures, Ignacio sighed.
“One of the most difficult descisions to make. The Nordwagen has good comfort and drove almost as perfect as the expensive Riemann. The easy usability of the interior is nice, it has solid buttons, and the materials are nice. And this is a looker with excellent safety. But the Heimat Toehn handles firmer, has much better fuel economy and … well, looks brilliant as well. I guess I have to flip a coin!”
Rank 2 with 130.08 points: Nordwagen Kümmerling by @moroza
As said above. It perfectly fits the brief and it is consistent in front, rear and interior (the latter not judged). It has a credible backstory and an own identity perfectly fitting what was actually sent in here. Well done! Design was rated 8,5 out of 10.
THE WINNER with 130,71 points: Heimat Toehn Ambition by @vouge
It a very close finish. The Toehn feels already the breath of the Nordwagen behind it. It did not deliver the best values in comfort and drivability, where the Nordwagen scored a little bit more. But it managed to be in the top five in all stats. Just like a real life VW Polo, its not fancy, it is maybe a bit boring, but it simply has no disappointment and 81,4 reliability are even better than a real life VW. I rated it 9.5 out of 10 in design because it is very detailed, no mismatches, and extremely realistic. And a 86 year old would probably be conservative and prefer this over the … expressive… Nordwagen.
So, was it a change for the worse now?
Definitely not! After calling Rüdiger and getting his Toehn, Ignacio drove a lot better. Cameras, Assistants, a smooth automatic transmission, all that made his driving easier. Letting go his beloved Primus Astrona to new adventures with a younger, fitter owner proved to be the right descision. Was the old car better? In subjective, yes. It reminds of younger, healthier, easier times. Objectively, the Heimat Toehn does almost everything better than the Astrona.
EPILOGUE
In the beginning, I stated I want to do a real QFC, not another fake-CSR. I proved that with lenient rules that avoided binning, but messed up with the in-depth reviews. But I think I owe them to the creators since most of you sat hours on their entry.
What made me also have lenient rules was the fact that I told that I was away for a week and this was hard to accept for some. THIS IS A GAME! Nothing that would ever be important in your life. Doing this without an own PC from far away led to some confusion, and some already started building before I could mention some clarifications.
This led to the rather confusive hard and soft rule system, since I wanted to avoid that early builders had to start from new. Thankfully, all entrants were able to read the brief and except a price rule violation or overlooking the minimum comfort, which can happen (messing this up myself frequently) it worked surprsingly well.
All cars were in a very close range, except the first and last two. But most entries were in a range of approx. 15 points - which is definitely not much. So this was a surprise, definitely. A minor improvement over your competitor boosts you like 5 places up. It surely helped that this time, design was not top priority, so judging was more, well, objective.
The democratic attempt at the setting was quite an interessing development, but I will NOT do it again. There were many complaints, but surprisingly, I got a ton of entrants. So maybe this was not as unwelcomened as it seemed at the first days of this QFC.
With having well over 30 cars lately, one might not always follow the inital QFC. Maybe this challenge just needs to adapt to the fact that the community is really active at this current point, and challenges can evolve over time. So I do not feel like missing the target when doing something rather different than the “classic” QFC, despite announcing the opposite before. Please let me know what you think about this challenge and how it turned out.
One last thing… I thought about publishing the spreadsheet. I will answer you in DM what design rating you had. But I will not publish it. I absolutely do not want to fight with people arguing “Why has XY a better stat than me, mine is so much better!!!11111111!!”
I do not have the time and the nerves for that.
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Splended! Thanks @Happyhungryhippo for hosting it was a good and intense round given the fact that 0.7 points is all that separates Heimat from Nordwagen. Congrats to everybody especially to those who made it into finals.
As for hosting QFC25 am gladly going to do it, I have an idea or two. The next round will be up in a few days.
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What about releasing the spreadsheet, but with all the ratings removed, just pure stats? I’m curious in what areas other cars beat mine, especially if there’s something I wouldn’t expect.
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Eitherway I can tell design wasn’t weighted anywhere near heavily enough, and favouring larger wheelbase builds even though in the brief they were “convinced a smaller one is easier to handle”
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